New York pollsters are hitting the Humboldt Bay area seeking intel on residents’ election proclivities.
But prepare for a head-squeeze — the choices are as narrow as the ding-dongs pushing the poll. They ask if you’re:
- Pro-Growth or No-Growth?
- Jobs or Environment
- Rail Road or Recreation
- Conservative or Liberal
Step right up. Fit yerself into puppet master’s box.
And just to keep your mind jiggled, some questions rival the brown acid.
Want Murl Harpham for City Council? How ’bout Bonnie Neely? Anything’s possible!
Pollsters want to know how favorable or unfavorable you find entities such as:
- Humboldt County Planning Commission
- Eureka City Planning Commission
- Humboldt Board of Supervisors
- Eureka City Council
- Humboldt Bay Harbor Commission
- Dennis Hunter
- Bonnie Neely
- Ron Kuhnel
- Jeff Leonard
- Larry Glass
- Nancy Flemming
- Chris Kerrigan
- Paul Gallegos
Final questions ask for age and number of years in Eureka.
The tone of this post makes me think that Heraldo might be a little disappointed that one of the questions from the Hipster Dufus Pollster Company was not:
“Do you want to know who Heraldo of the Humboldt Herald is? Or not?”
I wait for my call.
-boy
Actually we know who the Heraldo(s) are but it you say they are ____ and ____, you will be moderated.
I had a grand old time with one of these push pollers awhile back. I asked lots of questions (that they couldn’t answer) and responded ‘Don’t Know” to many of their questions. Getting them off their script was a fun challenge.
The Heraldo(s) are Burt and Ernie.
… a script. That is funny.
-boy
The sky is falling, eh HumCPR supporter?
what made it a push poll?
Chris Kerrigan does he even live here any more, no participation in any community activities or any job and the last 4 years on council were embarrassing the alley scandal the drugs his friends left in his house the forgetting about council meetings and his weeks upon weeks of correspondence at his city hall office, just because he is Bonnie’s boy toy does not make you a politician.
421:
Pro-growth vs No-growth is a false dichotomy. If that is literally the way a question was formed, it would certainly be considered a push to get people to think in these either or terms.
Doesn’t sound very pushy.
To you.
It pushes a false dichotomy.
All 4 of the top questions try to frame the issues in such a way as to help the pollster’s client to run their most favorable politician’s race. They’re all false dichotomys, this has Rob written all over it.
Push poll — short calls, high percentage of citizens contacted, slanted questions of the “when did candidate X stop raping his wife?” type. We all agreed on that definition at one time, remember?
What you’re talking about is a poll. Unless you’re saying that a true poll only asks essay questions.
And, please, don’t let CapD be right again. It is “railroad.” The other Heraldo has/had better grammar.
depends on your definition of No Growth, doesn’t it…HumCPR calls Healthy Humboldt No Growth even though Healthy Humboldt supports Alternative A, which would plan for 6000 housing units in the next 20 years. Doesn’t sound like No Growth to me! Oh yeah but the realtors and developers are No Limit to Growth, so they see any limit (however reasonable) as a limit on their profits.
It does sound like either Mr. A is behind the poll or HumCPR or both.
Are the pollsters only contacting Eureka residents?
Definately a poll which does not allow for those who are somewhere in between; middle of the road; independent; or, a little bit of both, etc… Polls seem to be a waste of time in my opinion.
Jeffrey Lytle
McKinleyville – 5th District
Jobs or environment? C’mon, how about carrot or stick? Enter or exit? Paper or plastic? Give me a break. Why don’t they ask something meaningfull, like should the toxic waste in the balloon tract be cleaned up or swept under the old asphalt rug?
I guess Hank is the only one who knows what a push poll is.
Push polls like this disgust me. Why can’t the questions be fair, and then if the results are not in favor of whatever the group’s agenda is, then they wouldn’t have to make them public? Either way, if they ask fairer questions it’s beneficial to the group paying for the poll, because they can have a better, more realistic understanding of the community they’re trying to persuade, rather than paying for easy and misleading results that they can only use as an empty talking point.
Well now, who do you think is paying for this one, Mr. A with the sunshine face? He is constantly looking for a edge to get more control, i.e. land grab and develop. What a TURKEY!
Generally if the results are what the group who does the poll wants they will publish them. If they are not you will not hear a word about it.
please look up “push poll”
The person I talk to after receiving the the poll call, said he thought they we testing 4 names, Jeff, Nancy, Bonnie and Merle. He thought the rest was just filler.
Voter,
Have your read the plan and Option A? Supports growth inside existing communities only and since the only place that has sewer service available is McKinleyville, that means Option A is the Only McKinleyville Option. Watch out McKinleyvillians, you are in for a real change in your area, most of which you may not want.
Heraldo nailed it a week ago in prognosticating the right-wing huddle over who was going to get to run against Bonnie.
The jostling has begun.
Hank’s right. There’s polling and then there’s Push Polling – Push polling attempts to influence ” rather than measure ” public opinion ” by using questions worded in a manner intended to spread information that is often incorrect about people and positions that run counter to the position of the poll’s client.
This format, according to the book, “The Polling and The Public,” by Herbert Asher, is “a telemarketing technique in which telephone calls are used to canvas potential voters, feeding them false or misleading ‘information’about a candidate under the pretense of taking a poll to see how this ‘information’ affects voter preferences.
“The intent is to disseminate campaign propaganda under the guise of conducting a legitimate public opinion poll,” wrote Asher.
The National Council on Public Polls warns that such push polls are used not to collect information, but to “spread rumors and even outright lies about opponents.
“These efforts are not polls, but political manipulation trying to hide behind the smokescreen of a public opinion survey.”
“‘Push polls’ are unethical and have been condemned by professional polling organizations,” states the council on its Web site.
Remember Julie Francis’ “push poll” in Gallegos’ last campaign… Pacific Crest Research? Bellavia Research?
Here’s a push/pull for you guys:
http://cgi.ebay.com/2-x-CATERPILLAR-657G-PUSH-PULL-SCRAPERS-NORSCOT-1:50_W0QQitemZ280322834065QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20090315?IMSfp=TL090315125005r6573
The real change in Mack town happened twenty years ago. So what else is new?
* Pro-Growth or No-Growth?
Sure, I support growers.
* Jobs or Environment
I don’t have to make that choice any more. Steve Jobs made sure that the carbon footprint of new notebooks was lower after being blasted by Consumer Reports for bad environmental practices.
* Rail Road or Recreation
I prefer trains with the recreation cars so I can sit on the couch and whatnot rather than the being scrunched into a tiny seat. Definitely should have a snack bar if that is part of the question.
Too funny that people are trying to blame this on Arkley as well!
Either Sunshine or CPR paid for this one
Just had a neighbor say she was asked about me in this poll. I wonder how they framed it: “What do you think about that unemployed dude that lives behind you?”
Anyone have proof of who did the poll?
I’m not a fan of polls. Push poll or not. But push polls like the one Julie Francis conducted are particularly nasty.
Rose the basher. Didn’t Richard, Ken or Baykeeper do one too? You’re slipping.
McKinleyville is near the tipping point. It needs a watershed event (no pun intended) like Option A that pushes the residents into incorporation, thus relieving the county of its sugardaddy.
There are some developments already in the works that will rile mack towners once they realize what has been approved and that there’s no stopping it.
Example of a push poll
Hi Mike,
looks like your the one doing the bashing in this instance.
HERE’S A PUSH POLL . Many (crazy) people take lithium. Many(crazy) people forget to take their lithium. Would you support lithium for supervisor? YES or NO.
Rose’s definition of “push poll”:
“Any poll not funded by my candidate’s handlers.”
That seems to be the definition here as well.
Rose has her own set of rules
Hi Anonn,
I don’t agree with Rose’s politics, but if you use Average Eurekan’s definition of what constitutes a push poll, it does seem that the same holds here in on this blog. (and I love this blog).
Lotta hair splitting going on here.
I totally get the points being made about the nature of push polls, and perhaps this doesn’t meet the narrow definition of one. But the assertions that it is full of false dichotomies is valid. Jobs or Environment? What utter bullshit. By postulating that there are only those two answers, the poll does in fact push people into picking one or the other as though they are mutually exclusive. You want then environment protected? NO JOB FOR YOU!
How is that not a push poll exactly? Because they thought at least a little bit about trying to mask their intent? What difference does it make if the intent is so transparent?
Allowing for only black and white definitions of what is or is not a push poll ironically does the same thing as this poll. By not allowing for any nuance whatsoever, we fail to appreciate the context of what’s really going on, just as any answer to those questions fails to truly account for the huge space between choices.
OK, if this was a push poll, which candidates were they pushing?
While this may have been biased it does not look like a push poll based on what is here. A true push poll says something like “…it has been alleged that Candidate X is a pedophile”. “Would this make you more or less likely to vote for him (her)?”
Even though there is no evidence that Candidate X is a pedophile, the suggestion has been made and the voter is left wondering.
This is how a push poll works. Bad stuff.
just the facts please, don’t confuse the issue. heraldo said it is a push poll, therefore it is.
I’m shocked, shocked, to find out here that political campaigns don’t follow marquis of Queensberry style rules of truthfulnesss, disclosure, transparency, and honesty.
Thank you! thank you! H. for opening my eyes to what has apparently been going on right under my nose, unbeknowst to me. I never imagined that something like this could happen in this idyllic community where all the women are strong, all the men good-looking, and all the children are above average.
Back in the day I pushed a few Poles myself….
I pushed a big Swede one time too.
As long as it wasn’t any Samoans Mabel.
Heraldo: Hello HQ
HQ: Yes?
Heraldo: Are we doing any polling for Eureka issues?
HQ: No
Heraldo: I’m all over it boss
HQ: Excellleeeennnnnnntttt….
Ya!
Are you running, Buettner? You should.
Samoans?
You mean Fairhaveners???
A Non A Me:
The plan actually says that under Alternative B 75% of the development would occur in McKinleyville, which is the amount that has been dumped on McKinleyville in the recent past. McKinleyville is going to get the most growth whether they want it or not. Which is probably better than developing the McKay Tract and the ag lands in the Elk River, as long as it is infill and doesn’t expand the footprint of McKinleyville as it is today.
P.S. so what that means is than if we don’t let the developers use up all that infill area with 4 bedroom houses on 1/4 and 1/6 acre lots, McKinleyville can handle that without spreading up over the hill to Fieldbrook. If we let the developer-realtor-mortgage broker lobbyists get their way, McKinleyville and Fieldbrook will not be distinct communities for long. Just one solid expanse of lawns and streets.
With caller ID, I don’t answer toll free calls. I miss a lot of great vacation offers to places not near as nice as this. Unless they use a local number or a real area code, I usually won’t pick up the phone.
I may have missed it, but I didn’t see anybody get the number on their caller id. If anybody gets the poll and has caller id they should post the number so us blogers will know who it is.
About the McKinleyville plan. For too long there wasn’t much of one. Other places became cities. McKinleyville didn’t want to deal with the hassles of becoming a city. 10 years ago, it seemed to be a place that was happy to get any development it could get. Now it wonders if it’s water and sewage plant can handle the growth. At least they built a sewage plant. Perhaps Wayne was right when he said “If you build it, they will come”. Or was that Jim Morrison?
it wasn’t too much of a hassle that kept mckinleyville from being a city, it was the cost. the current mck plan was adopted in 01 or 02. i don’t believe it is the plant capacity that we are worried about, it is the size of the sewer lines. but the county knows all about that.
On Mack Town growth, there are issues including, but not limited to:
1. The sewer treatment ponds can only handle so much waste for treatment. Additionally, the levels of various particulants going into the water courses is still too high for State mandated numbers which has caused a back and forth discussion about what is correct and what is not correct; then, regulators change the rules and what became allowable is then again not allowable due to water quality standards being raised again.
2. A Tertiary Treatment Facility WOULD BE NECESSARY AND should be paid for by the County of Humboldt if it is going to force 75% of new growth into McKinleyville.
3. Larger sewer lines will need to be installed to replace undersized lines currently in place. This should also be paid for by the County if they are going to force 75% of the new growth on the McKinleyville community.
4. The roadways (which the county owes a lot of money to McKinleyvillians for yet to be done roadwork) would be tore up even more when replacing the current/smaller sewer lines with newer/larger lines. The current Sewer AND Water lines are in great shape for the size of the McKinleyville community right now from what I have heard. Again, any forceful hand at changing a community should be subsidized by the regulatory/authorizing agency or jurisdiction which is “Forcing” the new growth.
5. Without higher paying, longer term jobs, fewer people are going to pay for the fair share of impacts when that impact is “forced upon a community” being a forced home to “low income people” as it appears the county’s directive is attempting to manipulate through the General Plan Update process.
6. The county wants to USE McKinleyville to fill their State of California mandated housing quotas instaed of appropriating percentages equally to all areas in Humboldt County. The most probable reason IS existing services and very little forrested land in McKinleyville proper; even though more open space will be developed and essentially lost.
I have said all along that this General Plan Update Process has been a fraud since Day 1; and, I am not deviating. Further, the Planning Commission is going to retest the idea of a County Redevelopment Agency. The not so surprising statement which was made at the Planning Commission Meeting two weeks ago is essentially that Redevelopment was not done right the last time in attempting to persuade the public. Fraud never quits, it just reorganizes!
Jeffrey Lytle
McKinleyville – 5th District
Here’s an idea that I haven’t seen mentioned yet: maybe the people who put the poll together really cannot see any shades of grey. Maybe they’re aren’t too sharp, or the Big Guy who ordered the poll directed the questions because he figured he can do anything, even polling. This would put them squarely in the Fox News, Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh gang with all the other bright lights from the CONservative movement who are unable to deal with complexity.
I took the poll, looking forward to a “push” as advertised, but it was just a plan ol’ poll…
the real pushers try to f-with your head.
No push, just not very scientific. The reason it feels like a push is that your only given and either or choice, this creates a skewed result and is unreliable. the main thrust of this poll is to test names for the next election, after Frank won by so much. Arkley et al wants people with that kind of name recognition. How do they explain Linda’s victory then? Did frank win by so much or did George lose by so much? I wonder did the poll test Dave Tyson name? Did ask about Hank Sims?
Though not a textbook example of what is generally considered a push poll — very brief so as to allow calling many people, few or no demographic questions, slanted poll ‘questions’ that are meant to push respondents into thinking negatively about a candidate or issue, asking for a respondent by name — it was still pushy IMHO. If this had been a legitimate poll, there would not have been a question that offered no-growth as the alternative to pro-growth.
If that isn’t an extremely pushy question, than how would you rank these in pushiness:
Are you pro-defense or no defense?
Are you pro-police or no police?
Are you pro-jobs or no jobs?
Are you pro-soap or no soap?
How about these:
Do you favor fire-fighters or caging wild animals?
Do you favor the Marina Center or $50 plywood?
Do you favor a coroner or police cover-ups?
Or these:
Do you favor abstinence only sex ed or pregnant teens?
Do you favor giving up a few rights or another 9/11?
Do you favor private health insurance or 6 month waiting lists?
One other point. Push polling in a still new concept. The definition of what is considered a push poll is still very fresh and, perhaps, still evolving. I have a hard time excepting any definition as etched in stone for a concept this new.
Push polls have been around for quite awhile now, 06 and this one by no means fits the definition.
There was quite the discussion several months ago here on this blog about a poll that was derided by some of the more conservative posters here as being a push poll; Heraldo and others rightly pointed out that the poll was in fact not a push poll.
I believe Heraldo knows this is not one either, but for some reason those deriding this particular poll, or in the case of the earlier poll think by attaching the lable “push poll” they can smear it with the tactics of an actual push poll.
Not much to blog about these days, locally that is.
I don’t have access to an Oxford English Dictionary in my home, but according to an online source that appears to quote from the OED, the term ‘push polling’ was first used fifteen years ago:
The technique was used earlier, no doubt, but 1994 was when the phrase was coined. I think I first read about it in 1999 or so. When I said it was a new concept, I was thinking 15 years is pretty new. You may disagree.
The thing about push polling is that everyone acknowledges the use of the tactic as not playing fair. Since the false dichotomy of pro-growth/no-growth is also not playing fair (and it was used within a poll) the connection is easy to make.
The lesson for the originator of the questions is don’t use false dichotomies in your polls if you want to be credible to the general public. If you don’t care about credibility … well … there’s no lesson to be learned.
716-332-1195… That’s the number of the pollster who called me on Friday eve. at 5:34pm.
again, in order to be a push poll, they must be pushing something. which candidates were they pushing? why would somebody spend the money on a push poll in order to push a “false dischotomy”? what benefit would they gain?
Candidate or issue. The issue being pushed (and I am conceding that this isn’t a push poll in a strict definition) is that being against all growth is the only alternative to being for developers.
Pushing the “no growth” meme (which is a favorite phrase used often by the developer crowd) is obviously benefiting someone. Otherwise they wouldn’t use it.
I believe polls apply false labels to everyone, whether or not everyone realises it. The fact is that often times, labels are put onto people, issues, etc… falsely because they or it were part of something previously, maybe only once; or, maybe they associated with another who fell into the category of being labeled, thus by imputation, are a label themself.
Take development for an example. There is a difference between a developer that does developments (major housing subdivisions, commercial parks, industrial parks, public infrastructure, etc…) ALL THE TIME for a living. Then, compare the small person/property owner that does it once or twice. The “label” is that because a person does something once, it is convenient for others to apply that “development label” on that small person as if that is all the small person ever does, so therefore, that small person is just like the big person. Sure, within the defining process, development is development; and, even the definition of development is morphing into anything done on property which, could comparatively, define ALL Property Owners as developers. Even certain renters can become part of this apparant morphing definition. The point is that polls, just like manipulative criticisms tend to extrapolate, are using a false basis to win over the minds of the gullible and apathetic. This is really nothing new as far as human behavior is concerned. The key is to be a part of the truth and fact bearing establishment.
Jeffrey Lytle
McKinleyville – 5th District
My husband (not a reader of this blog, so he didn’t get the impression here) commented to me last night that he got an interesting call yesterday that he described as “kind of a push poll.” He’s an independent-almost-libertarian type, and the poll hit him as a tool for right wingers with ambitions. Not rocket science. It sounded to him like it was focused more on Jeff Leonard than anybody, if anybody. If that’s what it’s for, and he gets given a copy of the results, I hope Leonard knows he should report it as a campaign contribution.
… and those polls are NOT cheap. So if it’s a contribution, it’s a big one.
Does anybody know who is running for the three Eureka council seat yet?