Home > Big box, Eureka California, Wal-Mart > Wal-Mart to dig its ugly claws into Eureka

Wal-Mart to dig its ugly claws into Eureka

The idea that Wal-Mart would take over the old Gottschalks space in the Bayshore Mall has been kicking around since 2007.  Now it looks (almost) official.

The headline in Saturday’s Times-Standard said a “mystery retailer” is readying the space.  But a Google search of the architect named in the article, Shade O’Quinn, shows he’s Wal-Mart’s guy.

Eureka voters defeated Wal-Mart’s aggressive bid to build on the Balloon Track in 1999. Since then the sweat shop loving, union busting, main street crushing big box has been looking for other ways to infest our Victorian Seaport.  Skating into an empty space in the mall appears to be the ticket.

  1. evinator
    July 16, 2011 at 8:34 pm

    R U serious? It’s not a big enough space and Walmart loves to just be outside of the city limits so it doesn’t have to pay the taxes. It aint going to happen.

  2. July 16, 2011 at 8:40 pm

    Wal-Mart is now starting smaller stores.

  3. never@fear.org
    July 16, 2011 at 8:42 pm

    Tyson will cut a tax deal with them. He will say it is justified to bring jobs to Eureka. He will say that it will pay off in the future.

    The futures so bright you gotta wear shades

  4. tra
    July 16, 2011 at 8:57 pm

    An architect who specializes in Wal-Marts? Aren’t they usually just a big rectangle? Seems like he could do that job in about 5 minutes. I’m surprised they don’t just outsource it to Bangladesh or something.

  5. Plain Jane
    July 16, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    “the sweat shop loving, union busting, main street crushing big box”

    And they buy prison labor grown produce.

    “The ADC has sent its prisoners to work for private agricultural businesses for almost 20 years. The farm pays its imprisoned laborers two dollars per hour, not including the travel time to and from the farm. Women on the Perryville Unit are assigned to Martori Farms, an Arizona farm corporation that supplies fresh fruits and vegetables to vendors across the United States (Martori is the exclusive supplier to Wal-Mart’s 2,470 Supercenter and Neighborhood Market stores).”

    http://www.alternet.org/story/151488/martori_farms%3A_abusive_conditions_at_a_key_wal-mart_supplier?page=1

  6. July 16, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    get a foot in the door and wait for the rest of the Baysmell Mall to collapse, buy up the property from General Growth and whammie! Gotcha!

  7. tra
    July 16, 2011 at 9:20 pm

    As noted in another thread, the Gottshalk’s building is only 73,000 square feet. The Target store at the north end of Eureka is 126,000 square feet. I believe Winco and Costco are closer to the size of Target than to the size of the Gottshalk’s space. I’m not sure about K-Mart, but I think it’s probably somewhere around the same size as that space.

    With that size store, they could sell a lot of product, but aren’t likely to dominate the market. Might drive K-Mart out of business, though, and take a bite out of Target and Sears. If they have groceries, and the prices are good, they might do some real damage to the nearby Ray’s, but I doubt their prices would be any better than WinCo and Costco, and they’ll lack the space to have a very large selection of groceries, since they’ve got lots of other stuff to try to cram into that 73,000 square feet.

    (Someone on the other thread suggested they might be building a big addition, and if that were true, I’d say all bets are off. But the figure that was mentioned, $4.6 million, doesn’t sound like anywhere near enough for both renovations to the existing building AND a large addition. I suppose an addition could come later, though…)

    Don’t get me wrong, I think Wal-Mart sucks bigtime, and if this is going to be a Wal-Mart I won’t be shopping there. Their employments practices suck — union-busting, low pay, mostly part-time / no benefits jobs where the workers have to get food stamps and Medicaid to make up the difference, and so on. If I recall correctly, there were also some really outrageous cases where a large number of employees were forced to work extra hours, off the clock, without pay, or else lose their jobs.

  8. Matt
    July 16, 2011 at 9:35 pm

    Oh boy! More cheap plastic crap from China!

  9. pattycakes
    July 16, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    Tyson and Wal-Mart actually have a lot in common. They both peddle a lot of crap and neither adds any class to anywhere they are.

  10. Pitchfork
    July 16, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    Shade O’Quinn is the guy they bring in when they can put up their usual type big box. If they’re spending 4.5 million on renovations. I bet they will expand out the back. they could probably double the size. Expansion is the only way General Growth would make any money in this deal.
    The Brady Bunch will be dancing in the streets.

  11. Anonymous
    July 16, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    If you look at a satellite photo, you’ll see huge parking lots to the left and right of Gottschalks (behind the mall complex) that could possibly be built out. There is also space across from Ross that is walled off, presumably either storage or unused space. Couple the unused space with a build-out in the parking lot and you have yourself a very large store.

    I’m surprised by the listed square footage of Target and Gottschalks because at the same magnification in Google Maps, Target doesn’t look much bigger.

  12. July 17, 2011 at 2:53 am

    @11:51 Any alterations to the current location – if it is Wal-Mart – would trigger a conditional use hearing.

  13. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 5:41 am

    John… expanding an existing building, and in the process destroying habitat for automobiles in an area with already abundant vehicle habitat, would be denied… for what reason?

  14. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 6:11 am

    And here’s another hypothetical scenario… isn’t it within the realm of possibility for merchants next to Gottschalks to simply move to other vacant locations in the mall? Pay for merchants to move, give them extra as a thank you, and remind them that Wal-Mart coming to the mall will boost traffic to the mall as a whole. And in the back of their minds, let them think about when their leases expire and whether they’ll get renewed if they don’t take the deal.

  15. Decline To State
    July 17, 2011 at 6:29 am

    Assuming Wal-Mart is coming to town seems a bit premature to me. In the Times Standard article from Saturday the interim community development director clearly said that Wal-Mart’s coming was a rumor she’d heard. Other than an architectural firm that’s done some work for Wal-Mart in the past (as well as for a lot of other people) I just don’t see them moving into this small a space inside the city limits. Pattison Christensen, the assistant manager said in the same TS article that the new tenant “will give Eureka an alternative shopping experience.” While that is vague and could be construed many ways I just don’t see how anyone could see shopping at Wal-Mart as an “alternative shopping experience.”

    I think it’s a bit too early for the hand-wringing, let’s just wait and see what “develops.”

  16. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 6:50 am

    I just don’t see how anyone could see shopping at Wal-Mart as an “alternative shopping experience.”

    Target is an alternate shopping experience to K-Mart. Winco Foods is an alternate shopping experience to Ray’s Food Place and Safeway. Wal-Mart is an alternate shopping experience to K-Mart, Target, Winco Foods, Ray’s Food Place and Safeway. See now?

    And referring to the space as small denies the ample space that could be made available without increasing the footprint of the building. Move some merchants within the mall. Bang, you have the space.

  17. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 7:02 am

    I’m not so optimistic, DTS. “Wal-Mart declined to comment, replying twice via email that it did not “have anything to confirm or announce at this time.” A simple “It’s not us” would have sufficed, so it’s them.

  18. July 17, 2011 at 7:06 am

    I wonder if the mall was so desperate to fill space that they gave Walmart a deal that was too good to pass up.

    To be able to go from low occupancy to no vacancy with one contract may have been worth it to them.

  19. July 17, 2011 at 7:17 am

    I want it to be a Toys-R-Us…

  20. Smart 5th Grader
    July 17, 2011 at 7:21 am

    I sent this on March 30th to a few people in the press, possibly including Heraldo. Here’s my next call: No matter his position in the community, Rex, Robyn Junior and all the usual suspects will be on this bandwagon. Ribbon cutting and all.

    —– Forwarded Message —-
    From:
    To: *******@gmail.com>
    Sent: Wed, March 30, 2011 2:02:51 PM
    Subject: Breaking News

    You heard it here first.

    Bayshore Mall is in serious negotiations for occupancy with Wal*Mart, Best Buy, and Dick’s Sporting Goods.

    Always ahead of the curve, **********

  21. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 7:33 am

    You’re not casting your imagination wide enough. Think about the endangered nature of malls in America. Think about how they are surviving. Visit the Sacramento valley where a “mall” is really just a collection of big boxes. Think about when the Eureka Mall was an indoor mall and what it is today. Think about how Bayshore Mall has changed since the 1980s. Remember the local store that filled the old Baa Baa Sheepskins spot next to Kohl’s, then didn’t have its lease renewed? How many square feet would a store be if it spanned from Gottschalks to the edge of Kohl’s? A giant retailer may sign a 10 year lease. How long are the leases of all the small stores located between Gottschalks and the edge of Kohl’s? How long is a company with 8,000 stores in 15 countries willing to wait to secure a location in a city that previously voted against a zoning change? What would a mall company that filed for bankruptcy two years ago do to secure its viability?

    I have no evidence for any of this, but come on, I’m disappointed with this crowd. The far right and leftwing are great at imagining worst case scenarios. Work a little harder people!

  22. Ed
    July 17, 2011 at 8:07 am

    This puts the staa truck discussion in the proper light.

  23. Ben
    July 17, 2011 at 8:18 am

    General Growth does not own the Gottchalk’s building

  24. brian
    July 17, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Maybe it will be one of those “good” Big Box stores….right Eric?

  25. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:27 am

    So,

    the original developer is “FORCED” to re-design againa nad again the parking lay-out for the required number of spaces. Now, to say an “addition off the back” could work when it would eliminate parking spaces raises the question of economic opportunity and whom equal protections laws “fail” to protect…..

    Typical variance b-s. for tax dollars that go againmst most everything “previously mitigated” to “explain away” the previous pulled development permits…….same thing as the Round Table pizza swinging signages within public rights-of-way……lack of equal protections for standards, codes, laws, policy, implementation plans, etc……the forebearing signals of a collapsing country…….

    J
    L

  26. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:28 am

    General Growth does not own the Gottchalk’s building

    That’s irrelevant. If it owns any of the spaces between Gottchalks and Kohl’s, it has a stake in what goes into the Gottchalks space.

  27. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:29 am

    And by “stake” I mean an interest in working with the future tenant.

  28. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:29 am

    Oh yes Wal Mart bad, Home Depot Bad, Lowes Bad. How did you masters of the universe ever allow Target to sneak in?

    If a Wal Mart were to go in at the mall is it not possible that it would be a draw for the rest of the stores? The Mall needs something.

    I like Wal Mart just because it gets all the leftie, proggresive, wannabe brainiacs all fired up

  29. July 17, 2011 at 8:31 am

    Thanks for the correction, Ben.

  30. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:33 am

    raises the question of economic opportunity and whom equal protections laws “fail” to protect…..

    No, no, it really doesn’t. If they stay within the mall’s lot’s existing footprint, the issue would be whether a bigger store translates to more cars than was historically normal, and whether there are sufficient parking spaces to accommodate those cars.

    same thing as the Round Table pizza swinging signages within public rights-of-way

    If they’re not holding their signs in an aggressive manner, no harm, no foul. Stay in McKinleyville dude.

  31. where's CREG?
    July 17, 2011 at 8:35 am

    Does the expansion of the existing mall foot print and traffic flows trigger and EIR? Is a conditional use permit required? Does this interest the Coastal Commission?

  32. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:53 am

    is a multi-story addition

    Where did you obtain your inside knowledge of what is going to happen at the mall? If this information came to you in a dream, please clarify that point for us.

    the business license is in violation of the State’s business and professions code as well,

    No it’s not, which is why neither the City of Arcata or the County of Humboldt is interested in your conspiracy theories.

  33. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 9:28 am

    a Wal*Mart in Eureka might actually class it up a bit at this point. The place is a cess pool.

  34. Smart 5th Grader
    July 17, 2011 at 9:30 am

    Anon 9:28. Or in other words, How low can we go?

  35. Smart 5th Grader
    July 17, 2011 at 9:31 am

    P.S. It is only a “mystery” to the pathetic T-S.

    “Mystery retailer prepares to move into Gottschalks building; company to finance $4.6 million in facility improvements

    Another business is planning to move into the 73,000-square-foot Gottschalks building, but the question is — which one? Eureka-based property management company Carrington Co. [Full Story]

  36. Walt
    July 17, 2011 at 9:34 am

    “Class”? Walmart? And what’s wrong with cess pools (in their place)?

  37. Smart 5th Grader
    July 17, 2011 at 9:38 am

    Yes, “class it up a bit” ROTFLMAO !!

    http://www.peopleofwalmart.com/

  38. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 9:40 am

    Yes cess pool. Have you ever seen the homeless camps between the Mall and the bay? If you have not, you’d be shocked.

    Go Wal Mart !

  39. tra
    July 17, 2011 at 10:27 am

    I believe Wal-Mart has a policy of allowing people with RVs to camp overnight in their parking lot.

    So, we just need to get a bunch of junky old RVs and we’ll finally get the homeless campground that some folks have been clamoring for for years.

  40. shad.rick1@yahoo.com
    July 17, 2011 at 10:38 am

    Yes we expect to see the above the law gang and their captain down there behind Bayshore any night now.

    They’ll slice up their tents and scatter their belongings around and then call in the media the next day to show what a mess the homeless have made.

    Terrorizing the poor is what the above the law gang does best. They’ve been at it for decades.

  41. 06em
    July 17, 2011 at 10:51 am

    Do you feel uncomfortable and restless, 8:29, when you can only buy trinkets at Costco and Target and K-Mart and Sears? Are there just not enough sales in Eureka on items that make you grunt in conquest when purchased BOGO, and then chuckle in resignation when you sell them at the following years yard sale for 1/20th what you paid? Will there ever be enough stores selling exactly the same crap in Eureka to satisfy your lust for stuff?

  42. July 17, 2011 at 11:21 am

    Apparently, Anonymous 9:28 finds glamour in very strange places.

  43. July 17, 2011 at 11:37 am

    If this project goes forward we need at minimum to ensure that the construction subcontractors and construction workers are all local. That way at least the construction money will circulate in our local economy.

    After the Wal Mart opens all the cash will be winging its way straight to Bentonville, sucked right out of the local economy.

    It’s kind of like resource extraction, open pit mining or mountaintop renewal, except the resource is our local cash supply.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  44. July 17, 2011 at 12:14 pm

    Women of Humboldt County may not appreciate their new and permanent second-class citizenship.

  45. High Finance
    July 17, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    First, General Growth does not own the Gottschalks building, Gottschalks did.

    Second, Wal-Mart will not cause the Bayshore Mall to “collapse” it will rejuvenate it. It will bring in a lot of foot traffic and the other retailers there must be very happy about the news. I can’t think of any current stores there that would compete directly against a Wal-Mart.

    While you all may sniff and put on airs about how Wal-Mart isn’t good enough for you, there are a lot of poor people in town looking forward to the low prices. It will attract people from all over the county and Eureka will get a lot of new sales tax dollars.

    Whatever happened to the rumors about Best Buy moving into the theater space and taking over all the space between it and Home Town Buffet ?

  46. Eric Kirk
    July 17, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    I can’t think of any current stores there that would compete directly against a Wal-Mart.

    I can only think of two or three that probably don’t. And I would worry about having to outbid WalMart once my lease expired if I were another business in the mall.

  47. socodave
    July 17, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    Heraldo said, “Wal-Mart is now starting smaller stores.”

    There’s also a rumor that they are also looking at the Kneeland Post Office as part of their infestation plan.

  48. July 17, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    “Wal-Mart is now starting smaller stores”?

    Damned with faint praise.

  49. July 17, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    Lets see, Walmart sells, groceries, tires, guns, clothing, bed bath and beyond stuff, furniture, guns & ammo, sporting goods, garden supplies, electronics, appliances, music, movies, books, office supplies, pet supplies, toys, baby supplies, air conditioners, plumbing, floors, window coverings, lawn care, home security, paint & decor, computers, luggage, tools and even a pharmacy.

    Yeah, that shouldn’t effect too many businesses. Only those that sell the above mentioned.

  50. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    They don’t manage rental properties so HiFi isn’t concerned.

  51. Mitch
    July 17, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    Tourists coming to Humboldt are always a little nervous that they may be leaving America behind for someplace different. “Will I need a passport?” “Do they speak Merican?” “Will I have to smoke pot or attend a protest?” This has kept us from becoming the natural tourist destination that is our destiny.

    With a Wal-mart, tourism will soar. People will come from far and wide to “Shop by the Redwoods!” (TM)

    “Imagine being able to walk through a peaceful old growth forest and buy a low cost video game from China… all in the same day. That’s the Humboldt Magic (TM).

    “There’s more, though, much, much more. Gaze at a Victorian Mansion. Sorry, no visitors allowed.

    And check out our beautiful and unique town center, the correctional facility. No tours here either, but you can hear the basketball while standing nearby.

    Need a tattoo? Nice nails and hair? Bail bonds? “Eureka’s got it!” (TM)

  52. July 17, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Didn’t Wallmart buy Gottshalks when it went bankrupt?

  53. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Carol, I remember talk about it, but don’t think they did.

  54. skippy
    July 17, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    Following the City’s successful partnership with ArkCo, we’ve now expanded with the Small-Mart Company bringing you our latest Redevelopment Block Grant City Projects, Phase II, joint ventures:

    Acne Grease, Lube, Oil, and Latte Recycling Company
    Pool Sharks Swimming Pool Supply- “Where the Customer is Our Chum”
    The Gassy Knoll Truck Stop- Fatter People are Harder to Kidnap
    Dairy Air Plane Charters
    Rush, Rush, & Delay- Humboldt Attorneys at Law
    Drs. Chu, Payne, and DeKay- Dentistry and smiles with a toothless twist
    Rook Takes Pawnshop- Eureka’s place to hock your cheap stuff
    Stinky Stork Diaper Service- “Normal, Healthy Baby? Supersize it for Only 49 Cents”
    Beaver Liquors and Cleaners- Need We Say More?
    Shanghaied and Fried Chicken- Home of the Proggie Special: 2 Fat Thighs, Small Breast, and a Left Wing
    Dirty Dick’s Halfway Inn- Broadway’s Premiere Meat Market. Yes, We Got Crabs!
    Big Willy’s Pumping Service and Sewage Removal- “We’ll Put Our Hose Anywhere. It’s not drain surgery, you know.”

    Hoo-boy. Folks, War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. Ignorance is Strength. Duh. That’s why The City and Small-Mart are working harder to bringing you a brighter future.

    Our Motto: “Don’t worry what people think, they don’t do it very often, everything is fine, and just keep watching TV. You say Potato, we say Tater.”

  55. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    ROFLMAO SKIPPY! Very much appreciated. Will you post the address when Beaver’s opens?

  56. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 3:01 pm

    Tom, your list is excellent. Just about every product line you listed has already been ceded to big boxes. Wal-Mart will feed off the customers of competing big boxes. The big exception is gun sales, so it’s heart warming to know you’re worried how local gun shops will fare.

    However, Wal-Mart’s primary competitor is Amazon. A big box has got to position itself in relation to web sales or it will disappear. In that respect, few locally-owned businesses should be significantly harmed, maybe independently owned Ace Hardware stores.

  57. July 17, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    “They don’t manage rental properties so HiFi isn’t concerned.”

    Zinger!

  58. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 4:10 pm

    tra, R U for REAL?

  59. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 4:14 pm

    Mr. Sebourn, I understand the argument you are making about Walmart selling everything. What I don’t understand is how you fail to see that Costco sells the same stuff. Why is Costco o.k? Is it because Costco might have a more “upper class” feel?

  60. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    Costco sells high quality products for a good price, pays their workers well and gives them benefits. They aren’t trying to monopolize the retail market, buy our government, put their employees on public services to increase their own profit. They don’t get fined for overcharging customers, get fined for not obeying labor laws, force their suppliers to continuously cut costs – virtually forcing them into outsourcing their production, etc, etc, etc. And they don’t buy their produce from farms which use $2 an hour prisoners forced to labor in unsafe conditions.

  61. Plain Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 4:33 pm

    That $2 an hour first has to cover “room and board” and if there is anything left over, family support is paid and the prisoners get what’s left, if any, to spend at the commissary. Do you think they get Walmart prices there?

  62. Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 6:02 pm

    In reply to Mr. “High” Finance.

    I guess it depends on your definition of class doesn’t it. But class is a good place to start this discussion. I’m copying my thoughts from Erik’s blog.

    The checkers currently at Costco make around forty grand a year. WalMart checkers are at minimum wage. That forty grand gets spent in our local economy. Even WalMart’s retail arm is likely to carry shelf-stable foodstuffs and will impact several jobs if not drive out several local retailers over the course of the next three years.

    For those armchair economic quarterbacks who like to grouse about outsourcing while complaining about not having access to low cost goods…

    WalMart just spent 2.25 million on free gifts to Congress. That is just a portion of its annual lobbying (check out the Sunlight Foundation site). Kmart and others–don’t. WalMart has more power in Congress than your single vote. WalMart isn’t spending that money in your interest it is spending it in WalMart’s interest.

    WalMart is the WORLD’s largest employer. It is a safe bet the company isn’t lobbying for living wages, better health benefits, or to end outsourcing and increase taxes on the stockholders. In the past two decades companies like WalMart have seen phenomenol growth from technology savings, tax reductions, elimination of regulations, etc. Profits have soared. Wages in this country however have stagnated. Those profits are not “trickling down” to anyone in the working class.

    Every time you spend a dollar at WalMart some portion of that money goes to undermine the long term economic interests of the working class. Kmart and most other chains based here in Humboldt are not international concerns (unless you want to count Canada). They are national. They do not have tax havens in Sweden and warehouses in Singapore. They do not have the power to elect representatives to Congress by themselves unless they join with the Chamber of Commerce.

    WalMart just changed the playing field for all the working class by arguing before the Supreme Court that women with biased wage complaints had no standing to file a class action lawsuit. One of the few methods to collectively bring a complaint against a large employer in the United States.

    That is the difference. That’s not in the least bit “classy” in my opinion.

  63. tra
    July 17, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    tra, R U for REAL?

    Let me check….OUCH! Yup, I feel pretty darned real!

    But seriously, if you were referring to my 10-:27 comment that said…

    I believe Wal-Mart has a policy of allowing people with RVs to camp overnight in their parking lot.

    So, we just need to get a bunch of junky old RVs and we’ll finally get the homeless campground that some folks have been clamoring for for years.

    …then the answer is: First paragraph is “for real,” second paragraph, mostly tongue-in-cheek.

    But it would be kinda interesting to see what might develop if Wal-Mart tried their “RVs O.K. overnight” policy here. I have a feeling they might get a lot more takers than they really wanted, and not necessarily the fancy late-model RVs. Probably quite a few school-busses-converted-to-campers.

    At any rate, it’s probably a moot point, because I doubt the Bayshore Mall management (not to mention the Eureka Police Department) would allow it.

  64. July 17, 2011 at 6:30 pm

    To use High Finanny’s logic,

    We should prohibit WalMart from coming here to protect the weak – those among us who are hopelessly addicted to cheap junk – from buying it here.

    Just interdict the source and the addiction will go away, isn’t that correct you drug warriors?

    It’s the compassionate thing to do, right Hi Finanny?

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  65. July 17, 2011 at 6:58 pm

    Anonymous 4:14 pm, Costco is a membership warehouse and doesn’t sell to just anyone. And what Jane said about the way they treat women, labor and abuse our system for their shareholders.

  66. Jane
    July 17, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    Costco will sell to anyone willing to give it 40 bucks a year for free use. There are very few people who can’t meet membership rules. The 40 bucks of course, with few strings attached, is a massive capital investment for the company collectively.

  67. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    Just watch the Brady Bunch supporters melt away if she backs a Wal-Mart conditional use permit. Recall bells a-ringin’!

  68. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 8:16 pm

    Also Jane, anyone can buy from Costco without a membership.

    Step 1. Give a friend who is a member some cash.

    Step 2. Have friend buy you a Costco cash card.

    Step 3. You use the cash card to enter and buy stuff at Costco, even gas. If you lose the card, you lose the cash. If you don’t mind that, you could load a cash card with up to $1,000 at a time.

  69. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 9:08 pm

    I have never been in a Costco, Target, Lowes, Kohls, or Best Buy. I haven’t been in a K-Mart for about 10 years. I occasionally shop at Wal-Mart if absolutely necessary (I live in Crescent City with fewer options). And I NEVER shop on-line as that is the real destroyer of locally owned businesses. If I cannot find something that I need in stock at a locally owned store, the item can usually be ordered giving the store owner the chance to make the sale. Read “Big Box Swindle” by Stacy Mitchell.

  70. Who Cares
    July 17, 2011 at 9:33 pm

    So, Glass and friends, doesn’t feel like the dirt just keeps piling up on you?

  71. Anonymous
    July 17, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    I have Amazon Prime and buy a lot of my merchandise online. It’s allowed me to ditch my car and get along by shopping in person only at the stores within walking distance. It has also saved me a ton of time because I’m not driving to Eureka anymore.

  72. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 2:00 am

    Buying online is so much like what the progressive visionary wrote in “Looking Backward” about a hundred years ago, it isn’t even funny.

  73. Walt
    July 18, 2011 at 6:10 am

    That would be Edward Bellamy, 1850-1898. Wikipedia calls him an American author and socialist. Here’s an interesting quote from Looking Backward, published in 1888:

    “My friends, if you would see men again the beasts of prey they seemed in the nineteenth century, all you have to do is to restore the old social and industrial system, which taught them to view their natural prey in their fellow men, and to find their gain in the loss of others.”

    Welcome to Wal-Mart. Caveat emptor.

  74. July 18, 2011 at 6:17 am

    Anon 9:08,

    Like Anon 9:45, I’m a heavy user of Amazon (not for books). Like Costco, Amazon doesn’t feel at all the same to me as Wal-mart.

    If I were to discover that Amazon treated employees the way Wal-mart does, I’d stop. But I’m not aware that they do. I’m not happy that they are fighting California to avoid collecting sales tax.

    Amazon seems to me to be simply a far more sensible way of getting things where I don’t need anyone’s help in making selections. When a local store adds value by having an informed staff, or offers post-sales help, I’ll consider them. But when a local store offers nothing over a service that will deliver to my doorstep, usually for less, and take things back no-questions-asked, I’ll use that service.

  75. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 8:56 am

    and take things back no-questions-asked, I’ll use that service.

    Amazon bans customers if they return too many items. Google for “amazon banned for returns.” Plus, 40%+ of landfill waste is cardboard, and a good chunk of that is shipping cardboard. Internet ordering is extremely wasteful, and directly competes with local businesses.

    If someone is going to say they feel good about Amazon and Costco, but dislike Wal-Mart, well, you have no credibility with me.

  76. Plain Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 9:01 am

    Anyone who discounts the very real differences between Costco and Walmart should have no credibility with anyone.

  77. SmokeMonster
    July 18, 2011 at 9:49 am

    Wal mart is a despicable corporation,that being said some of the conspiracy theory on here are laughable at best.

    I am curious how many of you were here when Kmart opened in Eureka and people were parking all over the cemetery next door for blue light specials.

    Simmmmer donnna.people

  78. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 10:08 am

    I’m not a fan of WalMart, but they will probably have the biggest impact on the other corporate stores.
    Cheap underwear sales will be taken away from Kohls
    Cheap plastic crap sales will be taken away from KMart
    Cheap electronics sales will be taken away from Target and Costco
    Cheap tools and tires sales will be taken away from Sears
    Cheap clothing sales (of all sorts) will shift from KMart, Kohl, and Sears.

    Most of the successful local stores have already found niches that can’t be easily satisfied by cheap retailers. For example quality outdoor products, upscale clothing, books and music that are not in the top 10, specialty foods, etc.

    My prediction is that the Eureka KMart will fold within a year or two if WalMart comes to the mall. KMart already appears to be struggling. No tears shed there.

  79. High Finance
    July 18, 2011 at 10:24 am

    “Most of the successful local stores have already found niches that can’t be eazily satisfied by cheap retailers.”

    Exactly 100% correct.

    People like Mitch cause many many times more damage to the local economy by shopping on Amazon than anything that Wal-Mart could. Even the hysterical ifnonsense spouted off by the Wal-Mart haters was true.

    And PJ (sigh), I have a friend who is a checker at Costco. She laughed when I told her about your comment that they make “40 grand”. She makes about $20 grand.

  80. Plain Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 10:31 am

    And HiFi, I didn’t say how much Costco workers make. There is a Jane posting who isn’t Plain Jane, but $20K plus bennies is better than $16K (if you are one of the minority that works full-time) and a hell of a lot better than the part-time $8K where the only bennies (foodstamps, medicaid, housing subsidies) are paid by the taxpayers.

  81. July 18, 2011 at 10:32 am

    I can’t understand why anyone shops at Costco, that monument to middlebrow consumerism, but nobody would prefer to work at WalMart, where exploitation has been so cruelly perfected.

  82. July 18, 2011 at 10:34 am

    Oh, and HiFi, I’d like to see what your checker says when you suggest that she apply for a job at WalMart.

  83. Plain Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 10:41 am

    Oh, wait a minute. Costco pays cashiers $15.60 an hour. .That comes out to over $32,000 a year plus bennies – or roughly twice what Walmart pays. I’m sure your Costco cashier neighbor can hardly wait to move up in the world to Walmart.

  84. Plain Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 10:43 am
  85. July 18, 2011 at 10:46 am

    Actually the internet provides a big opportunity for small local busniesses as they can establish a presence on the web and sell nationally and even internationally. Even little businesses in rural Humboldt County can do this if they find the right product.

    Its a lot cheaper to build a website than to construct 5,000 supercenters, and in a sense a small business can compete on an equal basis with WalMart on at least a few specialized products.

    Fed Ex and UPS use air cargo so truck size is pretty irrelevant in this internet segment.

    So it is true that the internet is competition for local businesses but it also provides a great opportunity to compete in a far larger market than was ever possible before.

    It’s not all downside.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  86. Plain Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 10:47 am

    Assistant managers at Walmart make a few thousand more than Costco checkers, but they have to work all the overtime demanded without extra pay and much is demanded.

  87. July 18, 2011 at 10:51 am

    Let’s revist the minimum wage laws for Eureka. Raise the minimum wage for companies that employ over 100 employees in Eureka to $12.00 an hour and require that they provide benefits to anyone working at least 50 hours a month.

    That will address the scandalous treatment that Wal Mart employees are subject to.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  88. Auntie Arkley
    July 18, 2011 at 11:03 am

    I think Big Al is on the right track.

  89. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 11:05 am

    Well certainly we don’t have to worry about people acting in their own short term self-interest in Humboldt.

    First let me clarify that interviewing one person at Costco not fully employed isn’t evidence of much except that single person’s wages. I appreciate the sentiment but the conclusion is weak. The jobs are highly competitive because they are stable and do carry benefits and do pay living wages for those who hold the full time positions (thank you Plain Jane).

    But the lack of complex analysis is troubling. Kmart, for example, serves those on the edge of the financial abyss by allowing lay away purchases. This keeps Kmart afloat, acting as a short term lending arm, without charging people 400% usury interest like Payday loan places do. If Kmart goes under these people will be forced into the other system of legal extortion. The idea that Kmart is validated by how many shoppers come to its doors doesn’t mean anything except that some people can’t do the long term math or see the long term impact on quality of life.

    Amazon is a different beast. The company needs to pay sales tax so that other businesses can compete fairly online. The fact that the online sector exists is about as much competition needed to keep most industries in check. There is only so much premium one can charge for face to face shopping when online is just a click away. It keeps local stores in check from gouging. But more importantly a local retailer can certainly go into online sales if they wished with a reasonably small investment. A local retailer CANNOT compete against WalMart nearly as successfully because it cannot lower the cost of doing business as well. They do not have the volume nor the capital.

    And WalMart just keeps expanding in more and more sectors so finding safe niches is rare. Just drive through the Prairie States and see what WalMart has done to these towns. Literally they have become the “company” town. WalMart’s initial strategy was to go in and open two stores a short distance from each other–drive out all competitors, then close one store when it’s purchasing power was not longer needed.

    And again, Amazon is not the World’s largest employer. Amazon has much less of an impact on training new CEO’s than WalMart has in business schools. The more successful WalMart is financially the more highly valued it will be in America–and modeled after.

    Personally, I cannot shop at WalMart without thinking of my children’s future in a society where wages are dropping, public education is being gutted, healthcare is nonexistent for the working class and unions are being busted. If one has enough wealth stored to ensure their children’s future they aren’t likely to shop WalMart anyhow. These people will likely be the stockholders who share the profiteering, shop elsewhere, and have access to healthcare and education through private resources. But if the working class poor continue to shop like they are going to be rich tomorrow then there is little room to complain about the lack of political power, public services, and opportunity for their children to climb out of the servant class. Not to mention the lack of real jobs and living wages.

  90. July 18, 2011 at 11:14 am

    Just drive up to Klamath Falls.

    Wal Mart built a store 2 miles out of town.

    Downtown looks like Katrina came through. It was destroyed by WalMart.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  91. July 18, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Let’s have Amazon pay an income tax to California or if that won’t fly some kind of corporate “use tax” to California.

    But I am opposed to expanding the sales tax because the sales tax is the most regressive tax we have. The poor are paying too much already.

    Over the last 30 years the tax burden has been shifted heavily to the bottom half through the expansion of the sales tax and the reductions in income tax, property tax, capital gains tax and inheritance taxes.

    I agree that the problems of California and the Federal government can’t be solved by spending cuts alone and there must be some revenue enhancements but regressive sales taxes are not the way.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  92. 06em
    July 18, 2011 at 11:23 am

    Poor Walmart. :-(

  93. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 11:23 am

    Oopsy, maybe you were counting on no one being familiar with Klamath Falls. It’s a nice little town, eco-groovy even if it doesn’t mean to be.

  94. Mitch
    July 18, 2011 at 11:24 am

    Anon 8:56,

    I’d be interested to find out how much more cardboard Amazon uses than is used in shipping products to stores. Same thing with gas. Amazon’s operation seems very, very efficient, and cardboard is money to them.

    I can understand that any retailer would ban a customer they feel is being abusive of their process. I’ve returned things, and it’s never been the slightest problem.

    If I lack credibility with you, that’s fine. I just try not to follow anyone’s party line just because it’s a party line.

  95. July 18, 2011 at 11:26 am

    I lived in Klamath Falls for a few months in the summer of 2005. I am relating my first hand experiences as of six years ago.

    And I didn’t insult the town, I commiserate with them.

    There are plenty of nice things in Klamath Falls but every other building on the main drag was empty when I was there. Have things improved?

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  96. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 11:31 am

    I just pulled this up out of the National Employment Law Act website. This is what is coming to town.

    http://www.nelp.org/page/-/Justice/2011/WalmartNYCtestimony2011.pdf?nocdn=1?nocdn=1

  97. Mitch
    July 18, 2011 at 11:35 am

    Hi Fi @ 10:24,

    Excellent, as always.

  98. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 11:35 am

    I understand that a couple of European countries mandate that companies using excessive packaging (like for big appliances, etc.) have to pick up the packaging at the consumer’s house a few days after delivery. Of course they contract out to a private company to do this but it works and then the packaging is recycled.

    I always thought this was a good incentive to put on business as a cost because it would push business to use minimal packaging. As long as the recycling burden falls to the consumer there isn’t as much incentive on businesses to reduce packaging.

  99. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 11:37 am

    Wasn’t it Bill Holmes aka highboldtage who fouled up the last move for a living wage in Eureka?

  100. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 11:38 am

    The sales tax issue for Amazon is just a leveling of playing field between businesses so other companies can compete. It retains an unfair advantage. Your point about the overall value of sales tax is well taken.

  101. July 18, 2011 at 11:51 am

    I pushed the campaign to raise the minimum wage in Eureka to $10,00 an hour in 2008. The campaign failed for lack of signatures. We needed around 1300 as I remember and ended up with about 600+. I accept responsibility for that failure. I was a bit naive about the local politcal culture here in Humboldt.

    Biggest problem is I didn’t have enough volunteers to gather sigs. My estimate is you need a solid crew of at least a dozen gatherers and you will probably have to go house to house to succeed at a petition drive in Eureka.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  102. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 12:14 pm

    High Finance says:
    July 18, 2011 at 10:24 am
    “Most of the successful local stores have already found niches that can’t be eazily satisfied by cheap retailers.” Exactly 100% correct.
    And PJ (sigh), I have a friend who is a checker at Costco. She laughed when I told her about your comment that they make “40 grand”. She makes about $20 grand.”

    Exactly false! Most local retailers sell kitch junk working people do not need, like sneeds. Things we need like food, affordable clothing, and essential household items have all been virtually monopolized by the giant retailers and the mega-retailers. Try opening a mom & pop store and see how much a pair of Levis cost wholesale. They are cheaper at Kohl’s. Lost Coast Brewery, for example, sells beer by the case to Costco waaayyyy cheaper than they sell it to loyal customers at THEIR BREWERY or to any local small grocery store! Wal*Mart, Costco, etc pay little or no taxes. I could itemize the endless list of examples ad nauseum. Set up a mom & pop store to sell essentials and see how much taxes you’ll end up paying. The deck is sooooo stacked against mom & pop businesses and so beneficial the the mega-corporations, giving a new meaning to the term “welfare state”.
    PJ 10:41 has already corrected the falsehood of Low Fi on his wage fallacies.
    99.99% – 93.99%? $20,000 – $32,0000? Low Class Finance doesn’t care much about the accuracy of the numbers he throws about. But what do we expect from a selfish, greedy, partisan hack?

  103. Walt
    July 18, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    “Lost Coast Brewery, for example, sells beer by the case to Costco waaayyyy cheaper than they sell it to loyal customers at THEIR BREWERY or to any local small grocery store!” Very true. Back when Pottermania was just getting started, I knew a bookseller who said he could buy the books cheaper RETAIL at Costco than he could buy them WHOLESALE from his supplier. So he did.

  104. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    Costco calls itself a wholesaler, one purpose of goods purchased there is for resale. “retail” sales.

  105. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 1:04 pm

    Lost Coast Brewery put their beer in cases without six packs ONLY for Costco so MOM & POP CAN NOT SELL THEM retail.

  106. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    puts

  107. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    Pricing 101. Costco and similar businesses dictate the packaging requirements for any supplier. Most small local businesses can’t afford to expand to produce the volume needed to supply Costco nor change their packaging design to commit unless they can get funding to expand. It’s a gamble. Smaller micro-brews don’t even try. Costco has a huge market and specific space demands and quantity based packaging. If a small retailer wants to make .01 cent per 1 million items and sell throughout the Northwest chain in lieu of making 10 cents per 10,000 items selling just locally or regionally it has to comply. It is a big step for any company to have the volume available to keep Costco in supply. That is just part of the relationship. A smart merchandiser/pricing strategy decides whether or not to undercut other distributors at the expense of having a big centralized volume dealer.

    But the bigger point is–if you don’t like it and care about the consequences, don’t shop there. Consumers drive the lower prices for big chains. You can’t demand rock bottom prices and still call for Mom and Pop shops to succeed and living wages to be paid.

  108. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    Pricing 101? or Monopoly 101?

  109. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    Lost Coast Brewery put their beer in cases without six packs ONLY for Costco so MOM & POP CAN NOT SELL THEM retail.

    Mom and Pop CAN sell them by the bottle at small stores (especially in the outlying areas) and for considerable mark up at restaurants. Costco began as a wholesaler to small retailers and I think they still give some early hour preferences to those types of customers.

  110. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    “Most local retailers sell kitch junk working people do not need, like sneeds. Things we need like food, affordable clothing, and essential household items have all been virtually monopolized by the giant retailers and the mega-retailers”

    Go to local store stores to buy food that does not take a toll on the environment and doesn’t kill you.
    Go to local stores for high quality clothing that is not made in sweat shops and will not fall apart in six months.
    Buy locally produced, energy efficient and/or repurposed appliances.

    If you want “short-term” cheap stuff then you should expect the demise of local retailers and the growth of big retailers. If you put your money where your mouth is, the small retailers will survive. This is what I meant by the small retailers filling those niches. By the way if you buy products like shampoo, soap, and grains in bulk, it’s much cheaper at ENF than Safeway. You just can’t buy the name “sneed” brands.

  111. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 1:59 pm

    Every new niche producer has to decide if they are going to sell their soul. Take Crocs for example. Niche footware, exploded for a time until product maturity. They could have decide to only sell to Mom and Pop stores. Or sell to every distributor for the same price regardless of volume. But the devil came knocking with the offer of riches, fame and a big contract. Buy ‘em for $18 in Costco.

  112. High Finance
    July 18, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    You all should check those links more carefully PJ.

    The Costco checkers only make that amount after four years of experience. But it is higher than I thought. They start out at $10.81.

    Fact Checker, can you link to anytime that you have ever been correct about anything ?

  113. Jeff B
    July 18, 2011 at 2:07 pm

    1:46- “If you put your money where your mouth is.” This is the statement we all need to be thinking about. I know many liberals who echo PJ’s thoughts and shop at Target and shortly be shopping at WalMart. If people would pay the extra 10-20% and shop at local mom and pop’s, WalMarts’ wouldn’t overtake our communities. There is a lot of hypocrisy in our community where many of the people who disparage the big box store also shop there to save a small amount of money.

  114. Jane
    July 18, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    High Finance. If you are going to challenge Fact Checker perhaps you can model for him and cite your own source. Most employers start at lower wages for a training period. Citing starting wages without more context isn’t as meaningful as you suggest.

  115. Not A Native
    July 18, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    There have been a number of local seminars and numerous media stories of how people living in HumCo can make their livings by selling products directly on the internet.

    Some create web ‘stores’ that simply agglomerate products from Amazon(and others), accept orders and drop ship merchandise, while collecting a commission. Periodically, I read articles by local folks who say they are successuly doing just that.

    Is selling over the internet globally any better for local economies than buying? BTW, if I need a product/service that isn’t available from an established local vendor, how should I go about obtaining it? Should I forgo the utility of having it?

  116. Jeff B
    July 18, 2011 at 2:41 pm

    What product or service are you speaking of?

  117. July 18, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    Here is the information on Costco pay:

    http://www.glassdoor.com/Hourly-Pay/Costco-Wholesale-Cashier-Hourly-Pay-E2590_D_KO17,24.htm

    Bill: Maybe it is time for you to revisit the $10 an hour minimum pay for the City of Eureka. My hand is up as a volunteer signature gather person.

  118. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    The world is full of big boxes competing with each other and small retailers trying to compete with their own as well as the big boys. You can make choices where to shop. What else do you want to try to control?

  119. buhbye
    July 18, 2011 at 3:40 pm

    Borders just announced it is closing all remaining 400 stores. Liquidation to take place as early as Friday (Thursday is the hearing). More room for WalMart at Bayshore Mall.

  120. Mike
    July 18, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    Looks like Borders has finally gone belly up. Poor Bayshore Mall. The local bookstores must be ecstatic…

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43797505/ns/business-consumer_news/

  121. Mike
    July 18, 2011 at 3:46 pm

    Dang, scooped by 5 minutes!

  122. July 18, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    Hello Richard,

    Thanks for the offer to volunteer.

    Although you and I are normally on the opposite side of the political spectrum I do remember that you were one of the few local pols who openly supported the initiative in 2008 and I appreciate that.

    I think it is worth revisiting, first because it is the right thing to do for lower paid workers and it would be good for the local economy.

    If it were to be tried again though I think I would limit it to larger enterprises in order to overcome the fears of some of the smaller local businesses that it would endanger them.

    That being said I myself no longer have the physical endurance to take on a project like that, age is catchin up with me. If someone wants to take the ball and run with it I will try to help as I can.

    It was worth trying in 2008 and it is worth trying now.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  123. Not A Native
    July 18, 2011 at 4:09 pm

    Jeff B I am thinking of a soil and water chemical analysis and a large autoclave.

  124. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    Anonymous says:
    July 18, 2011 at 1:40 pm
    Lost Coast Brewery put their beer in cases without six packs ONLY for Costco so MOM & POP CAN NOT SELL THEM retail.

    Mom and Pop CAN sell them by the bottle at small stores”

    Name ONE small store in Eureka (home of Lost Coast Brewery) where one can buy a SINGLE bottle of LCB beer? Or Arcata? Fortuna? (Jeez o Pete!)

  125. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 5:45 pm

    The local bookstores must be ecstatic

    Why? Because a bookstore chain with massive marketing and resources couldn’t survive in a dying industry? That it’s Borders walking the plank today and not them?

    Local bookstores will be unaffected. Borders mostly sold bestsellers, music, movies and crap (games, calendars, coffee). Independent bookstores won’t change their stock to fill the gap because most of this traffic will shift to Amazon and other big boxes.

    The stores that will benefit will be (in order): Wal-Mart, Target, Costco, the toy store in the mall, and Toy Box (children’s birthday gifts).

  126. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 5:54 pm

    “Name ONE small store in Eureka (home of Lost Coast Brewery) where one can buy a SINGLE bottle of LCB beer? Or Arcata? Fortuna? (Jeez o Pete!)”

    Jeez o Pete:
    This conversation started with your statement:
    “Lost Coast Brewery put their beer in cases without six packs ONLY for Costco so MOM & POP CAN NOT SELL THEM retail.” (Your shouting capital letters, not mine).

    A better response is that MANY local, small restaurants (Asian, Mexican, etc) sell single bottles of LCB beer, and it is likely some of those are taken from Costco cases. If you want, I’ll ask the next time I order a DTB at my favorite Asian restaurant. So, Mom and Pop CAN sell them retail, especially in local restaurants.

    But… You can also purchase a single bottle of LCB beer at California Street Market, Stop and Shop, and Eureka Natural Foods (to name a few).

    Better check your facts…

  127. tra
    July 18, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    Highbodtage said: “Fed Ex and UPS use air cargo so truck size is pretty irrelevant in this internet segment .”

    Well UPS only uses air cargo when you get it shipped for next day / second day delivery. Otherwise it goes by truck, same as most stuff that goes to stores. And in terms of fuel-efficiency and greenhouse gas emissions, shipping by truck is way more efficient than shipping by air.

  128. Fact Checker
    July 18, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    “You can also purchase a single bottle of LCB beer at California Street Market, Stop and Shop, and Eureka Natural Foods”

    Okay, so one can buy a single LCB at a few markets but not at most. Besides, that was NOT my original point nor quote. My original point was that Costco requires no six pack holder be provided by LCB in order to generally prevent mom & pop stores freom reselling beer which was my rebuttal to the claim that Costco is in the wholesale biz. Along with massive tax breaks, premium pricing, etc. Sorry you missed all that so you could dither over split hairs.

  129. July 18, 2011 at 7:13 pm

    Those of us on the left – the progressive Democrats, the Greens, the independent Left need to get together and reach some understanding and get some consensus candidates.

    We can’t go on in situations where one opponent runs unopposed in one district and then we field two candidates (and split the vote) in another. That is basically handing the election to the other side.

    I supported and voted for Xandra. I am not intending to stir up the past but we need a candidate to take on Bohn and also we are going to need a candidate for Eureka City Council. Presumably Linda will run again and I am fine with that. It is Jager’s old seat that will be in play. Can we get along long enough to get this done? Can we reach some consensus before we self destruct?

    And of course LInda will need some strong support, the Owen machine will be coming after her for sure. We need to stop underestimating him and his group they are eating our lunch.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  130. Anon
    July 18, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    Considering that we do not have 24 hour FedEx here as that plane would go from the Eureka/Arcata airport direct to Memphis and not be the little puddle jumper plane that goes from Murray Field to the Bay area, we have cut off any chance for manufacturing jobs as most need 24 hour delivery for small parts that are part of a larger project that may even be built in Europe. Most of the FedEx planes are full in the Bay area and can’t take more product and some of the small manufacturers need 24 hour to stay in business and were willing to move here but no one thought this was important for Humboldt County so no small manufacturing companies as they need the Memphis connection to be in business. We have the land and even the people that could work for them and have real jobs. There is absolutely no thought ahead for jobs and where they come from in this county and that is why we are at a standstill in jobs. The Supes all yap about we need jobs but some of them have killed any chance of getting jobs here (Hershey, steel home manufacturer, along with many others). That Supe is now gone after stopping jobs for many years since she became unelectable finally.

  131. July 18, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    The companies Anon is dreaming of would not be interested in Humboldt County regardless of who our County Supervisors are. Why set up shop for manufacturing in an isolated region, far from supplies and far from markets for finished products?

  132. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    “My original point was that Costco requires no six pack holder be provided by LCB in order to generally prevent mom & pop stores freom reselling beer which was my rebuttal to the claim that Costco is in the wholesale biz.” – Fact Checker

    And my rebuttal is that local mom and pop stores (particularly restaurants) do buy Costco cases and resell single beers. For these merchants, Costco is a wholesaler.

    If you’re going to call yourself Fact Checker, you better have the facts. In this case you didn’t. Oh, I cut and pasted your original post in my previous reply, so your statement: “that was NOT my original point nor quote.” is simply incorrect. In fact, what I quoted is the entirety of your July 18, 1:04 pm post.

  133. Anonymous
    July 18, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    Why set up shop for manufacturing in an isolated region, far from supplies and far from markets for finished products?

    Ask Amulet Manufacturing. They used to be based in Arcata.

  134. July 19, 2011 at 7:27 am

    I spoke with Amulet CEO Joel Risch about the move. He loved Arcata, but the lure of Idaho, near available steel and close to rail and freeways, lowered their costs significantly. Air service was not a factor.

  135. July 19, 2011 at 8:32 am

    You know most of us are enslaved by the commercial society we’ve created; so how is it you can pick and choose which commercial enterprise to be exploited by?
    “Oh, I think I’ll buy my ‘US-job-killing’ Asian crap from this store; because they support local communities..”
    Well, none of them support local communities. They can’t afford to, they live in a global society, as do we.
    I fought the first Wal-Mart, hoping against hope that Eureka would stay unique and special. But the people in Humboldt don’t care, they only want their consumptive fantasies. Look at the people they elected, individuals who know how to tow the corporate line.
    Do you believe in the Rich? Who are the rich?
    The whole Wal-Mart fight is like slaves arguing who makes a better master; the Southern Aristocrat, or the Yankee CEO.

  136. Smart 5th Grader
    July 19, 2011 at 8:54 am

    Moviedad 8:32 Well said, thank you.

  137. High Finance
    July 19, 2011 at 9:14 am

    “Fact”Checker is wrong again. Many places sell single bottles of Lost Coast Beer. Try Fairway Market & Ray’s.

  138. Fact Checker
    July 19, 2011 at 9:17 am

    Anonymous 11:05 a.k.a. LCB employee or distributor who knows where individual LCB botttles are sold. Wrong again, my original post said NOTHING of individual bottles. That was subterfuge you posted to distract from the point at hand. see below

    “Exactly false! Most local retailers sell kitch junk working people do not need, like sneeds. Things we need like food, affordable clothing, and essential household items have all been virtually monopolized by the giant retailers and the mega-retailers. Try opening a mom & pop store and see how much a pair of Levis cost wholesale. They are cheaper at Kohl’s. Lost Coast Brewery, for example, sells beer by the case to Costco waaayyyy cheaper than they sell it to loyal customers at THEIR BREWERY or to any local small grocery store! Wal*Mart, Costco, etc pay little or no taxes. I could itemize the endless list of examples ad nauseum. Set up a mom & pop store to sell essentials and see how much taxes you’ll end up paying. The deck is sooooo stacked against mom & pop businesses and so beneficial the the mega-corporations, giving a new meaning to the term “welfare state”.”

  139. Fact Checker
    July 19, 2011 at 9:23 am

    High Finance says:
    July 19, 2011 at 9:14 am
    “Fact”Checker is wrong again.”

    Wrong again No Class Finance. See original post, nothing of singles. That was subterfuge from a merchant.

    original unedited post from me attached.

    Fact Checker said:
    July 18, 2011 at 12:14 pm
    “High Finance says:
    July 18, 2011 at 10:24 am
    “Most of the successful local stores have already found niches that can’t be eazily satisfied by cheap retailers.” Exactly 100% correct.
    And PJ (sigh), I have a friend who is a checker at Costco. She laughed when I told her about your comment that they make “40 grand”. She makes about $20 grand.”

    Exactly false! Most local retailers sell kitch junk working people do not need, like sneeds. Things we need like food, affordable clothing, and essential household items have all been virtually monopolized by the giant retailers and the mega-retailers. Try opening a mom & pop store and see how much a pair of Levis cost wholesale. They are cheaper at Kohl’s. Lost Coast Brewery, for example, sells beer by the case to Costco waaayyyy cheaper than they sell it to loyal customers at THEIR BREWERY or to any local small grocery store! Wal*Mart, Costco, etc pay little or no taxes. I could itemize the endless list of examples ad nauseum. Set up a mom & pop store to sell essentials and see how much taxes you’ll end up paying. The deck is sooooo stacked against mom & pop businesses and so beneficial the the mega-corporations, giving a new meaning to the term “welfare state”.
    PJ 10:41 has already corrected the falsehood of Low Fi on his wage fallacies.
    99.99% – 93.99%? $20,000 – $32,0000? Low Class Finance doesn’t care much about the accuracy of the numbers he throws about. But what do we expect from a selfish, greedy, partisan hack?

  140. July 19, 2011 at 9:44 am

    “The whole Wal-Mart fight is like slaves arguing who makes a better master…”

    And Moviedad wouldn’t be in favor of a less cruel master if he were a slave in his metaphor? There are so many reasons to hate WalMart, not the least of which is their vigorous and successful defense of sexual discrimination in the workplace.

  141. Joe
    July 19, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    I cam from a small town of 15,000 people. Everyone was claiming that Wal-Mart would destroy our main street. It’s been 7 years and whenever I visit my old main street, most of the businesses are still open (some are in bigger locations)!

  142. Joe
    July 19, 2011 at 1:51 pm

    All the anti Wal-Mart folks have stated that Wal-Mart does not provide quality jobs. This town NEEDS more jobs. It’s hard to land a minimum wage job now a days.

    We listened to the no wal-mart people but where are the jobs? It’s been years and hardly any new jobs have been created. Bottom line is Wal-Mart will provide jobs and that is what this city needs.

  143. Jeff
    July 19, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    You bring up a good point Joe. The same people who attack WalMart present very few viable alternatives. They’ll tell you we need “good” jobs like we didn’t already know that. How do we get these good jobs, the ones that are so superior to WalMart, here to Eureka? And if you know how to do it, why hasn’t it happened?

  144. Plain Jane
    July 19, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    That’s funny, Joe. Did everyone in your little town discover a gold mine or strike oil? Why did you leave such a prosperous place?

  145. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    Fact Checker. I was responding to your 1:04pm post (scroll up and find it). Here it is in its entirety, exactly as you posted it:

    “Lost Coast Brewery put their beer in cases without six packs ONLY for Costco so MOM & POP CAN NOT SELL THEM retail.”

    My response to that post is that MOM & POP CAN SELL THEM retail – as single bottles. Furthermore, they don’t have to discard the non-recyclable, coated-cardboard sixpack holders.

    You said they CAN NOT SELL THEM retail. I showed YOU WERE WRONG, and wrong about Costco not being a wholesale outlet to small retailers. I brought up single bottle sales because it is how the beer is sold retail Jeez o Pete! – can’t you admit you were off base with that comment?

    By the way, I don’t work for LCB or Costco, and I’m not a distributor. I just read this blog and comment when I read bullshit statements.

  146. Plain Jane
    July 19, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    Here is a link to a long list of studies which show how much Walmart damages local economies:

    http://www.bigboxtoolkit.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=32&Itemid=52

  147. jane
    July 19, 2011 at 2:41 pm

    I’ll tackle this. Good jobs come with long term investment and good policy choices. It comes from taking a look at the resources we have available and building sustainable business and competitive advantage using what we have. It comes from understanding why people visit this region and want to live. It comes from understanding why people avoid this region and do not want to live here.

    For example, having a manufacturing base here in Humboldt does make sense to a degree. But not just any type of manufacturing. Manufacturing which produces toxic sludge into the water systems and air reduce the quality of life for everyone in the future. Additionally businesses which are considered a blotch on the landscape, even if they aren’t toxic, should be removed from the public eye because they will impact the other reason lots of people come here–the raw and natural beauty. In other words protect the natural assets and develop these further instead of blindly following what other cities in the middle of Texas nowhere are doing because it sounds like a good plan at the moment.

    Humboldt lacks a reasonable infrastructure for large businesses and the ability to port products in and out. That isn’t going to change soon unless the State funds straightening out 299 (Arnie had that idea and found out it wasn’t feasible). It is also a dead end track for most shippers and going back down the coast with an empty load makes the total cost of shipment too large for Humboldt size businesses. Loading those trucks with weed might be an option… but I digress into la-la-la grower land.

    So since the transportation problem isn’t going to be resolved any time soon the focus has to be on service companies, technology companies, and niche businesses with hand crafted or unique quality goods. We have a lot of that going already thanks to some good work by local development agencies. But building technology infrastructure is a must (there has been movement in this direction but not a real push). Building up the Arts community is helpful to retain highly trained, educated, and highly paid workers here but is not enough by itself. Building further the local education (and touting its successes) for top level workers and also technical skills so there can be quality lower labor (thank you College of the Redwoods) is key. Then there are the tax issues for local businesses.

    But the biggest thing is to convince the underground people not to be phobic about change, about bringing in new ideas (WalMart is not a new idea) and new people to the area. Diversity is a good thing. Humboldt has a lot of wealth to offer but most of it can’t be discussed or openly exported. The wealth of higher educated people who want to stay in the area pushes low level labor wages down and helps to make them stagnate. The person with a degree in physics might not be doing dishes at the Red Lion but a few English Majors are–for minimum wage. I like the idea of a living wage law but the Math isn’t always smart and Humboldt is too small to sustain a sweeping reform. Neither do I like to see small business owners charge a big mark-up simply because they are the “only-thing” on the coast and then not pass any of that gouging on down to their lowest level employees.

    I don’t necessarily see that Humboldt is on a bad track its growth rate is just slow and plodding and there are areas that can be more concentrated. The real threat I think is the conservative shift towards anti-tax everything, invest nothing, cut the pretty stuff (which makes tourism bigger), big corporations as the answer, and bring in dirty industry. I might go for more of this stuff if our asset wasn’t beauty and nature and the toxicity could be contained–but turning Humboldt into Texas is not a good idea.

    I don’t disagree with all of conservatism. Moderation is a good idea and making prudent calculated and studied investments is important. Public goods don’t work in the hands of private companies any longer now that populations are bigger. Government can take the economy of scale. Private companies only want to service the sector they need to make their dough and the rest of the population is left holding crumbs of service or nothing at all. Or worse, government gets in bed with the private company and special interests are created along with subsidies of private companies. I have always enjoyed Humboldt because it hasn’t gone down the “privatize” it all road as much as other areas.

    I disagree vehemently with social conservatives and am dismayed at their wins in recent elections. The big issue I have with the sarcastic tone of the word “liberal” is that it often comes from someone unwilling to read a strategy like this with any length. Someone who expects a list of items and ideas that they can wrap their mind around like big box stores and doesn’t understand the time involved in creating change and drafting policy (and retaining those policies as people grow impatient and change over government members who then switch policies, and so on). No tolerance for change and a quick label like “liberal” solves the problem of considering all the complexity or having to read and maybe do some homework. Not all conservatives are of this mindset and some people with more progressive views can be just as myopic. One thing for certain, labels are idiotic and lead to nothing productive.

    I’d really like to find a way to tax the income for all the trimming in the area so that businesses can compete with industry for better workers. But that is also pie in the sky. I’d also like to get government back into the hands of the average citizen and away from the special interest grow community. I hate the corruption. Again, pie in the sky.

  148. jane
    July 19, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    Dear Joe,

    WalMart jobs have been analyzed in small areas like Humboldt. Turns out there is a huge drain on the local services like public healthcare and other public aids because minimum wage just doesn’t cut it and WalMart doesn’t take care of their own employees. If the area loses 20 jobs at $15.00 and three business close (with local owners using local suppliers) and WalMart hires in fifty checkers at minimum wage part time and full time… it is pretty clear that there will be a net loss to local economy.

    But, hey, the cheap canned-cheese clan will be happy!

    Here is my personal alternative to WalMart. No change is better than WalMart.

  149. tra
    July 19, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    Bottom line is Wal-Mart will provide jobs and that is what this city needs.

    The bottom line is that these “new” jobs at Wal-Mart really just take the place of the jobs lost at the businesses they compete with. Often there is actually a net loss of jobs, and often the jobs at Wal-Mart pay less and provide fewer benefits, which makes for a net loss to the community.

  150. Plain Jane
    July 19, 2011 at 4:05 pm

    Wal-Mart and County-Wide Poverty
    by Stephan Goetz and Hema Swaminathan, Social Science Quarterly, June 2006
    The presence of a Wal-Mart store hinders a community’s ability to move families out of poverty, according to this study. After controlling for other factors that influence poverty rates, the study found that U.S. counties that had more Wal-Mart stores in 1987 had a higher poverty rate in 1999 than did counties that started the period with fewer or no Wal-Mart stores. The study also found that counties that added Wal-Mart stores between 1987 and 1998 experienced higher poverty rates and greater usage of food stamps than counties where Wal-Mart did not build, all other things being equal.

  151. Plain Jane
    July 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    A Downward Push: The Impact of Wal-Mart Stores on Retail Wages and Benefits
    Arindrajit Dube, T. William Lester, and Barry Eidlin
    UC Berkeley Center for Labor Research and Education, Dec. 2007
    This study analyzes the impact of the opening of Wal-Mart stores on the earnings of retail workers. (It uses a similar technique to account for possible biases in Wal-Mart’s store location decisions as the study described in the Retail Employment section, “The Effects of Wal-Mart on Local Labor Markets.”) This study focuses on stores that opened between 1992 and 2000 and concludes, “Opening a single Wal-Mart store lowers the average retail wage in the surrounding county between 0.5 and 0.9 percent.” Not only did Wal-Mart lower average wage rates, but “every new Wal-Mart in a county reduced the combined or aggregate earnings of retail workers by around 1.5 percent.” Because this number is higher than the reduction in average wages, it indicates that Wal-Mart not only lowered pay rates, but also reduced the total number of retail jobs.

  152. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    You have an actual case study of Wal-Mart’s effect on the community and economy 85 miles north of Eureka in Crescent City. This store is now open 24 hours daily and is being expanded into a Super Wal-Mart (one with a supermarket.)

  153. jane
    July 19, 2011 at 5:21 pm

    Thank you Plain Jane.

  154. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 5:42 pm

    Crescent City is not Eureka. It pains me to have to point that out.

  155. July 19, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    “Often there is actually a net loss of jobs, and often the jobs at Wal-Mart pay less and provide fewer benefits, which makes for a net loss to the community.”

    And also,when someone is hired they are given the paperwork to apply for food stamps,medical,etc.

  156. July 19, 2011 at 8:37 pm

    WalMart is cradle-to-grave awesomeness! It will provide cheap, disposable diapers for your babies, and corn-syrup “fruit-juice” in little boxes when the babies becomes toddlers. You’ll be able to provide your child with every form of processed “food” while they are growing, and you can buy the digital devices and games that will eventually alienate them from you when they reach their tweens. You’ll also be able to buy guns and ammo to protect all of these hard-earned gains, and if your kids don’t make it to college, they’ll always have a part-time job at WalMart (bonus your sons will have an advantage over the women at WalMart — but shhhh! Don’t tell Justices Thomas and Scalia that this is company policy).

  157. tenth street dreamer
    July 19, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    Take a look at down town Crescent City and you will see exactly what effect Walmart will have on Eureka. Once again the powers that be give the rest of us a kick in the shin. Depressing! And where do you go to get away from the largest retailer in the world? You can’t even take the shuttle to the space station anymore.

  158. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    hey, maybe it’s a Nordstrom.

  159. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    Crescent City is a town of 7,600 people an hour away from any place of note. Eureka is a completely different scenario economically and in every other way. If Crescent City is your example, you lose. Worst case scenario, if Wal-Mart comes to the Bayshore Mall, then maybe K-Mart will close a year or two later. It warms my heart you care so deeply about K-Mart.

  160. Anonymous
    July 19, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    Geeze you guys, what’s the problem?

  161. July 20, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Here’s an idea.

    The UFCW is a union that is trying to organize WalMart workers.

    Perhaps we could contact them and start orgainizing local potential WalMart workers before WalMart even opens.

    http://makingchangeatwalmart.org/

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  162. Leftie, Progressive, Brainiac
    July 20, 2011 at 9:51 am

    “I like Wal Mart just because it gets all the leftie, proggresive, wannabe brainiacs all fired up.” So, you like to watch a debate for debate’s sake, but don’t tire your little mind with what it is that’s being argued or what the consequences might be for your own community? When people make reasoned objections about Wal-Mart (or anything else) your wee eyes just glaze over, don’t they, sweetheart. There, there. Better take a TV break…I think there’s a Beverly Hillbillies rerun starting in a couple of minutes.

  163. Carla Baku
    July 20, 2011 at 10:25 am

    The entire Costco conversation regarding cases of Lost Coast beer is completely off-base. Costco wants to sell things at the lowest price possible, therefore they buy what are called “loose-pack” cases. Businesses like Lost Coast, Desserts on Us, etc., WANT their products in Costco, because Costco’s volume of sales equals greater profit. As for the beer question, any retailer can purchase loose-pack from the distributor, but it is typically more lucrative for the retailer to sell six-packs. The idea that Costco evilly conspires to do away with those .25/apiece six-pack carriers is a fallacy. Due to the three-tier system of beer sales that is the law in our great state. If mom-and-pop stores were to buy the beer from Costco and re-sell it, they would be breaking ABC (Dept. of Alcohol Beverage Control) law. The corner stores buy directly from the distributor, just like Costco does, and they can buy loose-pack cases, just like Costco.

  164. Fact Checker
    July 20, 2011 at 10:52 am

    Carla 10:25 Read it again. The points were:
    1) Essentials have been virtually monopolized by mega-retailers.
    2) Mega stores buy at the lowest wholesale prices (because of their monoploy) and consequently “wholesale” for small stores is greater than “resale” at mega-stores.
    3) Mom & pop pay lots of taxes, mega-stores pay little or no taxes.

    Please quit getting all wrapped up in my citisism of LCB for selling to Costco cheaper than their loyal customers who buy cases at the brewery.

    Fact Checker said:
    July 19, 2011 at 9:23 am

    “Most local retailers sell kitch junk working people do not need, like sneeds. Things we need like food, affordable clothing, and essential household items have all been virtually monopolized by the giant retailers and the mega-retailers. Try opening a mom & pop store and see how much a pair of Levis cost wholesale. They are cheaper at Kohl’s. Lost Coast Brewery, for example, sells beer by the case to Costco waaayyyy cheaper than they sell it to loyal customers at THEIR BREWERY or to any local small grocery store! Wal*Mart, Costco, etc pay little or no taxes. I could itemize the endless list of examples ad nauseum. Set up a mom & pop store to sell essentials and see how much taxes you’ll end up paying. The deck is sooooo stacked against mom & pop businesses and so beneficial the the mega-corporations, giving a new meaning to the term “welfare state”.

  165. Fact Checker
    July 20, 2011 at 10:54 am

    criticism

  166. Fact Checker
    July 20, 2011 at 10:57 am

    P.S. I know someone personally who has been employed by LCB for four years and they still qualify for food stamps.

  167. Carla Baku
    July 20, 2011 at 6:58 pm

    “Please quit getting all wrapped up in my citisism of LCB for selling to Costco cheaper than their loyal customers who buy cases at the brewery.”

    My clarifications about the specifics of how beer is sold to/by Costco wasn’t directed at YOUR post. There were several comments about the beer thing, and my reply was simply pointing out the facts about what loose-pack cases are, why businesses like Lost Coast sell to Costco, and that mom/pop stores buy directly from distributors, not from Costco. Costco sells product to people who can’t be “loyal customers” and buy at the brewery, because they live in, oh say, San Diego.

    Oh, and PS…I comment on whatever piques my interest and haven’t ever taken my marching orders from an anonymous blog poster. Bossy much?

  168. Fact Checker
    July 21, 2011 at 6:38 am

    Carla. “Please quit getting all wrapped up” hardly constitutes “marching orders”. A wee bit over-reactive ye be?

  169. High Finance
    July 21, 2011 at 12:24 pm

    Lost Coast sells to stores at wholesale prices so the stores can make a profit. The stores buy in bulk and on a regular basis. Bulk sales are cheaper for Lost Coast to sell.

    Lost Coast sells that same beer at their retail establishment for a higher price because running the retail location is more expensive. Patrons of the bar realize they are getting more than just a beer. I have never heard anyone there complain about it. It is a very simple concept.

  170. Mike Buettner
    July 21, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    Truck with big WalMart signs heading down Broadway today.

  171. Anonymous
    July 21, 2011 at 4:49 pm

    Fairly hilarious to see Bill “highboldtage” Holmes saying he isn’t up for circulating the living wage initiative in Eureka this time around.

    As memory serves, he wasn’t up to it last time around — but his insistence on controlling the campaign sunk the entire effort.

  172. July 21, 2011 at 6:26 pm

    As I said last week, I take responsibility for the failure. I made some bad decisions and misjudged the political terrain here in Eureka.

    And I pointed out that it will most likely require a house to house door knocking campaign to put any initiative on the ballot in Eureka. Just sitting at the coop, the library or the courthouse or arts alive once a month won’t get it done.

    Three years ago I could walk five miles without problem. Today a few blocks is about it. My body is aging. I am glad you find that “somewhat hilarious.” I find a certain humor in life’s circumstances but pain is not “hilarious.”

    I am unhappy that it didn’t make the ballot. I am not ashamed that I tried and failed. Linda Atkins, a sitting elected Democratic official couldn’t do it just last year on an issue that is less contentious. Getting a measure on the ballot in Eureka is not easy. It will take a dozen solid volunteers willing to walk the neighborhoods, and it will take close a thousand $ in filing fees, printing and advertising costs.

    In any case yes it is worth trying again. Anyone wants to make a sincere effort at it I can give some advice, spend a few limited hours at a stationary gathering spot, and maybe kick in a hundred or two $ towards the printing and filing costs. But I can no longer play any central role. In that I am being realistic.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  173. tra
    July 21, 2011 at 6:48 pm

    Bill,

    That was a very mature and thoughtful answer to Anon 4:49′s rather snarky comment. Well done, sir!

  174. Anonymous
    July 21, 2011 at 10:48 pm

    You couldn’t play a central role last time, Bill. Nothing to do with health, everything to do with you being a control freak — just as your perverse insistence on candidates like Xandra Manns staying out of YOUR race as if you own the bloody political system.

  175. 06em
    July 22, 2011 at 6:45 am

    Getting back to the topic, check out Walmarts carpet bombing of our country on a time lapse map. I think the blue bombs are Walmarts and the green bombs are Sam’s Club.

  176. Plain Jane
    July 22, 2011 at 7:17 am

    Too bad she didn’t stay out of the city council race, 10:48.

  177. Plain Jane
    July 22, 2011 at 7:20 am

    Metastasizing Walmart, 06em. A cancer on our country’s economy.

  178. July 22, 2011 at 7:59 am

    10:48 I don’t understand what you are talking about. I supported Xandra’s candidacy for city council and I would do it again.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  179. July 22, 2011 at 8:14 am

    There are two problems with Eureka’s municipal elections.

    1. The phony ward system. This is a perversion of the idea of one man one vote and is likely unconstitutional. It is designed to keep the moneyed elite of the city in firm control of the politcial process and it keeps the voices of the neighborhoods muted. This can be fixed by amending the city charter or by legal decision in the courts. The easiest way to challenge it in court is maybe by someone like Larry Glass filing for city council in a ward in which he is not resident. If the city denies his presence on the ballot he can challenge the denial on constitutional grounds. The principal is that the district of candidate eligibility must match the districts electorate eligibility. Imagine a situation where it is required that a California Senator must reside in California but the whole Unitied States would elect him or her. That is what we have in Eureka. If you want to have an at-large system like we have now then the district of eligibility must match.

    2. The lack of run offs. The curious first past the post plurality elections here in Eureka are guaranteed to produce winners without majorities, without clear mandates and also typically favor the establishment candidates. This can be fixed in several ways, including instant run off favored by Greens or simply by moving to an open primary in June with a run off in November between the top two candidates. Spoiler situtations will be avoided. Why don’t we do this?

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  180. July 22, 2011 at 8:23 am

    If you want to stop WalMart time is getting short.

    Raising the minimum wage is one strategy to discourage them that’s what makes the discussion relevant.

    Another strategy: Start unionizing their potential workforce NOW.

    A third strategy: Progressive taxation of retail space. Simple example: 1,000 sq ft retail space = 10 cents a sq ft retail tax. 50,000 sq ft retail space = 50 cents / sq ft retail tax, 100,000 sq. ft retail space = $1.00 sq ft retail tax. The principle of progressivity in taxation is constitutional.

    Of course the third option would tax Piersons, Safeway, Costco and Target as well.

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  181. Dave
    July 26, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    I am a lefty progressive and YEs, this town needs a WALMART, a Super WALMART.

  182. July 28, 2011 at 8:24 am

    Planning to move soon, Dave? There won’t be much to stay here for except CHEAP UNDERWEAR.
    The “leaders” of this town are still too stupid to realize that wealth comes from light industry and LOCAL businesses, NOT Big Box chains that are guaranteed to suck us dry.

    Boy I’m glad I’m retired. You’ll NEVER get there working for WalMart.

  183. Jessie Cortijo
    July 28, 2011 at 11:09 am

    For anyone who is interested in discussing how best to go about opposing this project, come to this event Monday. Open to everyone who thinks this is a bad idea–the more people and the more ideas the better: https://www.facebook.com/e​vent.php?eid=2281693238885​80

  184. Anonymous
    July 30, 2011 at 7:56 pm

    What specific town has Wal Mart ruined? I did a google search and can’t find the specfics. I have family member’s that sadly work for Target- certainly Wal Mart’s business practices can’t be any worse.

  185. realistic
    August 3, 2011 at 4:08 pm

    Im so looking forward to a walmart! My family loves their low prices and their products. You have to let people in to want people to stay here. Thats why everyone is leaving. No jobs……no future

  186. l.g
    August 24, 2011 at 5:51 pm

    it think they should add walmart to this boring county and i used to work in the bayshore mall as a jantor and they fired me for no reason i think just cause i was different some of the people that work as secuirty guards and jantors in the mall are sick i’m thinking about sueing the millard services in the mall i like walmart i think they should come i like there clothes i like most of there stuff good prices good stuff this county is so boring and has zero jobs out in southern humboldt fortuna rio dell way i’ll proabbaly have to leave this lame no job boring as hell rural horrible county please come in walmart

  187. jennifer solorzano
    October 29, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    i love wal-mart!…plus more jobs..i say go for it!

  188. Honesty
    November 2, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    As we ALL know… the whiners out there will be at Walmart the day it openes and fill their carts! Bayshore Mall needs to be stimulated before it will go bellyup. Walmart will do it! Prices-quality- will always win! Small buisnesses around Humbolt County that are RUDE to customers will be gone! When was the last time any of you whiners wear even at the mall? So go get some cardboard boxes and move under 101 or grow up and get jobs and shop at Walmart!

  189. BOB WALTERS
    November 7, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    WALMART IS COMING TO EUREKA, THE MALL IS NOW OWN BY A NEW OWNER. AS OF ABOUT A YEAR AGO.
    GOTTSHALK OLD BUILDING WILL BE A DOUBLE DECKER, THATS WHERE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE COMES FROM.

  190. November 7, 2011 at 9:18 pm

    So, when are they starting work on the store? Appears nothing has been done yet. I would love to see the store up and running before I am too old to care.

  191. Anonymous
    November 21, 2011 at 10:43 am

    anyone know if there is any petitioning still going on to stop the Wal-Mart?

  192. BeanCounterInCali
    November 25, 2011 at 6:10 pm

    The mall does not have a new owner, just a new CEO and cuthroat management philosophy. However, General Growth will be splitting off Bayshore Mall and 29 other malls into a separate company…
    http://www.ggp.com/properties/rouse

  193. November 25, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    Will they call it “The Losers Club”?

    KMart plus Target plus WalMart is piling on and is a penalty in all NFL games.

    I have yet to find a reason to set foot in Target.

    Economy? Who needs it as long as we have CHEAP crap whenever we want it.Oh boy oh boy oh boy

  194. Anonymous
    April 9, 2012 at 10:30 am

    I get so sick of hearing all this bullshit about walmart its gonna hurt businesses in Eureka ,why because they have reasonable prices it would be like any new business opening , the ones that have been around for a long might slow down for a while but after the newness wears off it will be right back to normal .Did everyone bitch and complain when target or kmart opened NO they didnt so whats the big f**king deal about walmart opening .There are people out there without a job and walmart will help them.

  195. joesgirl
    April 13, 2012 at 1:39 pm

    You people are just scared of change. These dam stores up here are really expenisve. I have a large family. All this talking bad what about the good they do. This company donates stuff for kids and familys.

  196. Anonymous
    April 25, 2012 at 2:03 am

    people… watch the the Documentary Wallmart: The high cost of low prices before you start wishing this company upon Eurekans… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiSmlmXp-aU

  197. May 23, 2012 at 10:47 am

    no..it doesnt suck the life out of our towns.. it allows the people that do NOT have mom and pop shops, that hire only family, THEN friends… to have the opportunity to shop for MUCH MUCH LOWER PRICES….

    Us “middle class” people, retiree’s, handicapped, etc. are NOW going to be able to AFFORD things.

    The mom and pop shops here are WAYYYYYYY over priced, forcing many of us to shop – on line.

    Why is it do you think, that many stores, especially new ones that are popping up – why do you think MOST go out of business? I have seen them come and go over and over again here in the small town of Eureka, Calif.

    Why? Because they are too darned expensive, partly because their RENT IS OUTRAGEOUS so they HAVE to, but others, that have been in business for yearsssss – still charge an arm and leg with no regard to the sects mentioned above.

    In my opinion, it isn’t the big stores that suck it’s the small town mom and pop shops that SUCK the MONEY out of our WALLETS, thus making life more and more of a struggle – often times, not even being able to purchase the items we need and going without… It’s very sad.

  198. Spend wisely
    May 23, 2012 at 11:22 am

    WalMart and other chain stores are able to get their products at a lower cost than small businesses. So can online stores. Mom and Pops can’t sell to you at such low costs because they can’t even get the merchandise for as low as what chain stores sell them for.

    But money spent at local stores stay local. Money spent at WalMart will leave Humboldt County. Nobody sucks money out of your wallet faster than WalMart. Nobody.

  199. Jack Sherman
    May 23, 2012 at 12:05 pm

    It’s a marvel of modern propaganda that so many people believe big box products are “cheaper”.

    Where’s the journalists that used to hunger on such burning ironies…. like the billions in public subsidies being spent to harvest other nation’s child-labor and resources without labor rights or environmental regulations, while tens of millions are unemployed here?

    This brand of journalist is also unemployed…of course…

  200. r and h soler
    May 23, 2012 at 12:10 pm

    Chances are —————–> whoever does NOT want Wal-mart in Eureka are: 1) rich/or well to do, and/or 2) employed, and/or 3) own a “mom/pop store” and/or 4) are probably Safeway (vs Winco/cheaper prices) shoppers, and/or 4) can afford to shop at mom and pops, Safeway, Sax, Kohl’s, etc.

    For the poor rest of us that are looked upon as LOWER CLASS, when in all actuality we are the struggling middle class. Eventually, these rich stores, mom and pop stores, etc. are going to WIPE our the middle class, and we will then, be categorized as poor.

    I have worked all my life, in management. Moved home to set up sick mother (with MS), we left a combined income/and our jobs – of $80K/year in 1992. We have NEVER been able to catch up since that time. We were there 6 yrs. We claimed bankruptcy, because we had just purchased a vehicle, and had tons of credit cards, bills, etc. we could no longer pay, as the place we moved is one of the most economically thrashed areas of the U.S. (upstate NY/Border town)…

    In any case, it is a sad, sad, world and day, for many of us. Overpowered by the rich and their wanting to charge an arm and a leg for their products at these mom and pops, of COURSE they dont want Wal-mart here, then the majority of us can afford it there!!

    It’s horrible, I realize the rent for these mom and pops are outrageous, but again, the owners of these bldgs/real estate are JUST as much to blame as they FORCE the mom/pops to charge higher prices to survive.

    I have watched, one by one, going out of business here. You drive down to Old Towne and one day a place is there – — – - – the next, it’s gone!!!!

    So, WELCOME WALMART – I am TIRED of having my POCKETS get the money SUCKED out of them by the mom and pops!!

  201. r and h soler
    May 23, 2012 at 12:32 pm

    Exactly. It’s soooo simple. No matter what ANYONE says, proof is in the pudding. Wmart gets things cheaper and sell them for cheaper because they can.

    GREED is another issue of the mom/pops, yes, some charge as LOW as they can, but some, ive compared on line/ebay/overstock, u name it, and they are wayyyyyyyyyyyyy over the top in re: to high pricing… :(….

  202. Anonymous
    May 23, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    r and h full of shitter.

  203. Anonymous
    May 23, 2012 at 1:07 pm

    Because local merchants should be able to sell for the prices of those who buy at fire sales and without the overhead of a retail outlet. R and H is an idiot who will likely be appearing soon at Walmart people.

  204. anon
    May 23, 2012 at 1:11 pm

    yup… but to call R&H idiots, well, its a fact that people that throw stones, and go name calling are truly the ones that wear the names on their necks, along with rude, and ignorant. We all have opinions, as they did, so, why get nasty. You must be one of the snobby ones they referred to LOL

  205. anon
    May 23, 2012 at 1:12 pm

    Is everyone in eureka so rude and nasty. wow im glad i dont live there

  206. A-nony-mouse
    May 23, 2012 at 2:05 pm

    Very LOW WalMart wages require low prices. To achieve low prices, WalMart employs children at dangerous unregulated factories in third world countries. Wouldn’t it be better to employ higher wage workers here so they could afford possibly higher prices for better quality goods? I guess all boats float with the tide.

  207. Thorstein Veblen
    May 23, 2012 at 2:37 pm

    Walmart started as a mom & pop store, as I understand it. Put them all out of business, and you won’t get the next walmart. Thats just bad capitalizm.

  208. anon
    May 23, 2012 at 2:57 pm

    husband just got a job at walmart/eureka.. management at a very good rate of pay. so, there is proof that wages are good for this day and age and comparatively reasonable in relation to other related positions for other companies.

  209. back in the saddle
    May 23, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    The choice is to have NO new business start up in Humboldt County because we will just rely on the pot business to keep the local economy going. Or we can encourage ANY business to start up here because when the potheads all leave (for whatever reason) then there just might be the chance of having a job. No to the port, the railroad, Walmart, Home Depot, anything that can provide a job. Go over to Redding and see what their shopping looks like. Warehouse, trucking, stocking, clerking, management, etc jobs are there – and yes everyone says that they are low paying – but it is a fucking job. What is YOUR plan for economic development – job creation – or however you want to frame it?

  210. Anonymous
    May 23, 2012 at 8:58 pm

    “Go over to Redding and see what their shopping looks like. Warehouse, trucking, stocking, clerking, management, etc jobs are there – and yes everyone says that they are low paying –”

    Yep, you’re right, things suck even worse in redding despite all the new big block malls that popped up over the last 10 years and that don’t pay squat and everybody knows it. We don’t need anymore space wasted to accomodate new retail outlets. We especially don’t need anymore space wasted to accomodate new megacenters. There’s plenty of slack in our existing residential and commercial infrastructure to boost it and grow from within.

  211. anon
    May 23, 2012 at 9:11 pm

    amen!!!!!!! back in the saddle, I didnt and couldnt have – - said it better – walmart isnt for the RICH and the MOM POP owners, God forbiddddddd we purchase something for 1/5th the price at WALMART LOL omg – i HATE small towns, IF i could move I would be gone in a second, but this place has gotten us in such a rut. my husband is skilled in like 6 different fields, has been in management for 20 yrs, and can’t get a job. He even went to a fast food place – EIGHT BUCKS AN HOUR (he WAS making 50K/yr in S. Calif and inFlorida… anyway, he worked there till they closed down FIVE.FIVE YEARS he was there…. its horrible here… – he has NEVER been without a job this long – 6 month -

  212. anon
    May 23, 2012 at 9:14 pm

    u cant grow from things places, etc. that people cant afford. Redding has a bunch of jobs listed, I see it daily posted to my email, as we are looking for a job for my husband. Even Arcata has more jobs offered than here… Walmart and such, may pay low, but like “back in saddle” said, at least its a job!!!!!!!!!

  213. tra
    May 23, 2012 at 9:21 pm

    Congratulations, you’re the winner…of a race to the bottom.

  214. Thorstein Veblen
    May 23, 2012 at 9:26 pm

    See discussion about begging as a profession, in another thread here.

  215. 713
    May 23, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    Hey TRA, you dont have to be an asshole, they are just trying to make ends meet.

  216. Steve
    May 23, 2012 at 9:59 pm

    That is it 87% Eurekains are closet meth heads, no job, no money, what money you do have goes to a meth dealer. I hate this town..”….

  217. Anonymous
    June 17, 2012 at 10:24 pm

    Hey I am headed to Walmart tomorrow. I don’t have to go to Del Norte or Mendocino anymore. Next Home Depot, Yeaaaaa!

  218. June 30, 2012 at 5:36 pm

    It’s amazing how our Victorian seaport is actually nothing at all….and Walmart moving here has not hurt anything. In fact, idiots, they have given 250+ people jobs…people who could not find work in Eureka because most of the business have closed. Grow up and shut up. Obviously you have a job or money and therefore nothing better to do with your time other then complain about a store that offer cheaper prices to our poor area people (which is 95% of the area) and jobs to those who were lucky enough to get hired. Thank God for Walmart!!

  219. June 30, 2012 at 6:50 pm

    In LA Walmart Protest, Thousands Of Angelenos March On Chinatown In Anti-Walmart Action:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/27/in-la-walmart-protest-tho_n_1632381.html

  220. June 30, 2012 at 6:51 pm

    And joe, you do blow.

  221. September 9, 2012 at 12:57 pm

    tra :An architect who specializes in Wal-Marts? Aren’t they usually just a big rectangle? Seems like he could do that job in about 5 minutes. I’m surprised they don’t just outsource it to Bangladesh or something.

    They do and pay their slaves 18 cents an hour,14 hours a day,6 and 7 day a week….

  222. September 9, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    Joe Bub :It’s amazing how our Victorian seaport is actually nothing at all….and Walmart moving here has not hurt anything. In fact, idiots, they have given 250+ people jobs…people who could not find work in Eureka because most of the business have closed. Grow up and shut up. Obviously you have a job or money and therefore nothing better to do with your time other then complain about a store that offer cheaper prices to our poor area people (which is 95% of the area) and jobs to those who were lucky enough to get hired. Thank God for Walmart!!

    Yes what a great mega corporation!Do you realize they and pay their slaves 18 cents an hour,14 hours a day,6 and 7 day a week in most poor countries???

  223. Plain Jane
    September 9, 2012 at 1:36 pm

    Calling Walmart employees “slaves” is unfair. Slave owners have an incentive to keep their slaves alive and reasonably healthy. Walmart has no such concerns, domestically or in third world hell holes.

  224. 713
    September 9, 2012 at 2:46 pm

    Mark,
    Why don’t those people get a higher paying job rather than working for Walmart at .18 per hour.

  225. September 19, 2012 at 12:27 am

    why not ?

  226. December 24, 2012 at 7:30 pm

    The other day, while I was at work, my sister stole my iphone and tested to see if it can survive a 25 foot
    drop, just so she can be a youtube sensation. My iPad is now broken
    and she has 83 views. I know this is entirely off topic but I had to share it with someone!

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