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Thompson town hall packed

KHUM DJ Mike Dronkers posted this photo on Twitter from his cell phone at Senator Mike Thompson’s town hall on health care at Redwood Acres.

Mike-ThompsonThe event was scheduled from 5:30-6:30 but Thompson is still taking questions from the audience as of this posting.  Listen live on KGOE.

  1. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 7:00 pm

    So, what happened? Did the elderly I-got-mine-from-the-govt, screw-everyone-else crowd show up in force?

  2. September 2, 2009 at 7:12 pm

    They’re definitely there.

  3. September 2, 2009 at 7:14 pm

    I’m guessing it won’t matter. Thompson will give his speech and things will go on as usual. Sure, some people will scream and yell (on both sides) but I’m sure he’s got his mind made up, as much as he ever does.

  4. September 2, 2009 at 7:15 pm

    Don’t you?

  5. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 7:21 pm

    A black man in power can be a scary thing to old people.

  6. Middle-o-the-strea m
    September 2, 2009 at 7:25 pm

    I cant beleve Thompson is still stumping this issue of lies

  7. Big Al
    September 2, 2009 at 7:56 pm

    just got home, the crowd was not tolerant of speaking out of turn, or shouting.
    it was good to hear both sides (or more) of the issue
    being discussed but I thought Mike took too long answering or commenting on the questions/statements.
    I think his mind is made up, gave us all a chance to say our piece but not if you went on too long, as some of the public was cut off when they rambled or were tangential or off topic.

    Bill were you there? what was your take?

  8. September 2, 2009 at 8:03 pm

    Hi Al,

    I was not there, my ride cancelled, but I went home and listened on KGOE – thanks Tom Sebourn.

    I thought that Thompson did a decent job, I thought that the comments supporting single payer were very strong. I don’t understand why people are so afraid of socialized health care.

    Single payer health care is inevitable, whether it happens now or ten years from now aften ten million more Americans have gone broke. Blue Cross and Blue Shield are too big to fail, and they will soon be owned by the taxpayers anyway just like the other corrupt insurance giant AIG.

    I am glad you got to attend Al, did you get a chance to speak?

    have a peaceful day,
    Bill

  9. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 8:03 pm

    I can’t believe it was necessary to hold “Town Hall” meetings about national health care. It’s a national issue, for the love of Pete! Not a municipal issue suitable for these so-called Town Hall Meetings.

    Did we need Town Hall Meetings to pass the New Deal? Of course not. Town Hall meeetings are a gimmick, and they backfired on the Obama administration when the insurance mob aggressively took them over.

    Now the U.S. Congress, which according to our Constitution is supposed to make our laws, is too afraid of the insurance lobby to pass National Health Care legislation. Private profit overrules the pressing needs of the American people once again.

  10. Big Al
    September 2, 2009 at 8:16 pm

    no insurance mob in eureka, it was a mob of Americans who were out to let everybody speak their opinion.
    no shouting mobs here. pretty darn respectful
    I did not speak, but my opinions were being represented by many others young and old.
    went expecting to see tea baggers but I got there just as it was starting so I may have missed them, I was able to get inside which was nice.

  11. September 2, 2009 at 8:20 pm

    Anon 8:03, I don’t know if you attended or watched the meeting, but it accomplished exactly what these small venues are intended to accomplish–allow regular folks to air their concerns and ask their questions in a public forum. The nutcases did show up, of course, but no one was willing to allow them to derail the conversation. There were also quite reasoned points made on both sides. Amazingly well done, Eureka.

  12. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 8:29 pm

    I was there for the entire meeting. Those in support of a public option or single payer outnumbered the tea-baggers significantly. At least 60-40; maybe even 2-1.

  13. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 8:33 pm

    Well, sure. It’s free health insurance!

  14. Ed
    September 2, 2009 at 8:34 pm

    I agree with 8:03. Town hall meetings have lately become just a means of blowing off steam. Too bad, they’re a good mechanism for local issues but are inconsequential for larger questions. As someone who wasted years commenting to regulatory agencies about the effects of rampant industrial abuses on our local economy and ecology, I have little faith in the public comment circus. Officials with their minds already decided often go through the motions of listening to those affected to assuage the guilt of betraying their constituents for the benefit of their underwriters.

  15. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    I also heard tea-baggers complain the crowd was “stacked.” One suggested that people had been bussed in to stack the crowd in favor of the public option/single payer.

  16. September 2, 2009 at 8:57 pm

    Amazingly well done, Eureka.

    I’m with Carla. The signal-to-noise ratio was way higher than I expected. I learned some things, anyway.

    And good on Dennis Mayo for being just about the only public figure of any persuasion who will consistently call out his own side when he reckons his own side deserves it.

  17. "HENCHMAN OF JUSTICE"
    September 2, 2009 at 9:02 pm

    Since when did Dennis Mayo have his own side? Seems to me he picks and chooses his viewpoints based on what he believes is right. This is not abnormal. It is good that Dennis is still with us after the vehicle accident he and his aunt were in. Apparantly, it was a very bad wreck caused by an oncoming vehicle. Speedy recovery Dennis!

    Jeffrey Lytle
    McKinleyville – 5th District

  18. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 9:07 pm

    I cant beleve Thompson is still stumping this issue of lies

    What he said was true. Stop listening to industry lies you sheep.

  19. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 9:10 pm

    It’s a national issue

    Correction: It’s a moral issue. Tea baggers embrace a culture of death.

  20. Big Al
    September 2, 2009 at 9:18 pm

    shame on the tea baggers,
    National Health Care is a moral issue!
    Bill Moyers on Bill Maher

    3 parts be sure to see them all

  21. Tim
    September 2, 2009 at 9:21 pm

    Congratulations Eureka. It appears from these early returns the tea baggers were outnumbered and forced to remain civil. I thought they would make this meeting like a Jerry Springer show. This is how democracy is supposed to work – civil discourse and respectful sharing of opinion. The politics of Lee Atwater and Karl Rove appeal best to the narrow minded minority.

  22. Babushka
    September 2, 2009 at 9:45 pm

    It was a good event with some bizarre overtones. A couple of guys wearing “Obama is a Communist” t-shirts sat there and clapped every time someone spoke up for reform. Maybe they were just being polite.

  23. mresquan
    September 2, 2009 at 10:04 pm

    Or maybe they support Communism.

  24. September 2, 2009 at 10:24 pm

    I thought It went pretty well.

  25. Michael Moore, Jr.
    September 2, 2009 at 10:24 pm

    Anyone know if the meeting will be podcast or archived anywhere for those of us who to work?

  26. Time to get real
    September 2, 2009 at 10:30 pm

    Ed, I would have to agree with you about the effect of public comment on decision makers. Once in a while I feel I have had some some influence on the outcome of an issue, but it has not been often. Even then, it is not clear that my opinion had any influence on the outcome. It just made me feel better that it went the way I would have voted. It is a very watered down way of doing things. Having owned my business for many years, I think I prefer the benevolent dictator approach. When I have all my own resources at stake, I prefer holding the deciding vote. Not to say I would replace our governmental system. I might refine it to be more people friendly and responsive, however. I can hardly wait for blackflag to have a go at this comment.

    And here on the blog, how many times has someone thanked another blogger for their insightful, yet apposing view, stating they are now changing their position. Not in your lifetime, or mine, I suspect.

  27. Reinventing the Wheel
    September 2, 2009 at 10:37 pm

    I arrived 30 minutes early and there were no seats! If people are honestly worried about their private health care their numbers were very small. Nearly everyone was remarkably well behaved! Alan Sanborn was a hit.

    But just in case detractors began shouting their illogical vitriol, I had my comments ready. Please borrow from the material below:

    “This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US department of energy. I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the national weather service of the national oceanographic and atmospheric administration determined the weather was going to be like, using satellites designed, built, and launched by the national aeronautics and space administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US department of agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the food and drug administration.

    At the appropriate time as regulated by the US congress and kept accurate by the national institute of standards and technology and the US naval observatory, I get into my national highway traffic safety administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads build by the local, state, and federal departments of transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the environmental protection agency, using legal tender issed by the federal reserve bank. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US postal service and drop the kids off at the public school.

    After spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the department of labor and the occupational safety and health administration, enjoying another two meals which again do not kill me because of the USDA, I drive my NHTSA car back home on the DOT roads, to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and fire marshal’s inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

    I then log on to the internet which was developed by the defense advanced research projects administration and post on freerepublic.com and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can’t do anything right.”

  28. September 2, 2009 at 10:50 pm

    Michael Moore Jr., Access Humboldt taped it with 5 cameras. I am sure it will run again. Call them for a schedule.

  29. Anonymous
    September 2, 2009 at 10:54 pm

    RItW,your point is a bit skewed,to say the least, but well written.

  30. September 2, 2009 at 10:54 pm

    And what Reinventing the Wheel said.

  31. Time to get real
    September 2, 2009 at 10:55 pm

    Here is a little background to help clarify where I am coming from. I went to work at 9:15 a.m. and left tonight at 9:35. I have taken almost no money out of the business in 2008-9, living on my social security so I can pay my employees, suppliers, landlord, PGE, phone, city water, workman’s comp, insurance for everything else, the list goes on. I rely on medicare with a supplemental policy so I am covered– I hope. Wells Fargo and I own my home and I have a truck and a car, one is 17 years old and the other is almost new at nine years old. That is reality for many of us, my friends. And still, I like my life and look forward to tomorrow.

  32. yo yo your mama
    September 3, 2009 at 1:10 am

    Heres a couple reasons why this health care bill would be a bad idea.

    • Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the gov option!
    • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure!
    • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed!
    • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)
    • Page 42: The “Health Choices Commissioner” will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.
    • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.
    • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard.
    • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.
    • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (example: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)
    • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.
    • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)
    • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens
    • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.
    • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter.
    • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No “judicial review” is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.
    • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages.
    • Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives.
    • Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families.
    • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll BR • Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll
    • Page 167: Any individual who doesnt’ have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income.
    • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them).
    • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records.
    • Page 203: “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax.” Yes, it really says that.
    • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected.”
    • Page 241: Doctors: no matter what speciality you have, you’ll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!)
    • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors’ time, their professional judgment, etc.
    • Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries.
    • Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs.
    • Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing!
    • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions.
    • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government.
    • Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies!
    • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval.
    • Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on “community” input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN.
    • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing.
    • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc.
    • Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals.
    • Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone).
    • Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia?
    • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time.
    • Page 425: Goverment provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death.
    • Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends.
    • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient’s health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT.
    • Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life.
    • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN.
    • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN.
    • Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage.
    • Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services.

  33. High Finance
    September 3, 2009 at 4:27 am

    Well, at least Mike Thompson was honest. He said he was in favor of the “public option”. The public option would eventually result in the government taking over the health care industry.

    Did he ever address the fact that even the CBO says his plan would add more than a trillion dollars to our national deficit in the next nine years?

    Sometimes these numbers get so high it loses meaning to most folks. One trillion is $1,000,000,000,000.

  34. 06em
    September 3, 2009 at 6:26 am

    yoyo,
    If I wanted to know what insurance industry puppeteers were writing about healthcare, I could have found one of their sites myself. There is no need for you to cut and paste their intentional misreadings and spin about one of the 5 versions of the bill. What are your own thoughts about healthcare?

  35. Walt
    September 3, 2009 at 6:46 am

    Good on HumCo for being rational (for the most part). Single payer is off the table because Mike and his colleagues (D AND R) are paid to keep it so. There is ALWAYS a quid pro quo. The blue dogs oppose the public option, and Mike is their treasurer, saying one thing and voting another. As for the tea-baggers. . .they know who their Master, LLC, is.

  36. Shakira
    September 3, 2009 at 7:33 am

    Lock down the borders and then with-hold the amount of money we spend on treating illegal alien mexicans from the price we pay for Mexican oil. Then the Mexican government would be paying for the health care of it’s citizens who are in our country ILLEGALLY! While we’re at it, charge them for the 25% of our prison population who are fine-upstanding mexican criminals who are also here on our dime. Throw in Tort reform too.

  37. Kym
    September 3, 2009 at 9:00 am

    Wow, So I read the Hearld and am proud of the restrained rational behavior of Humboldtians. Then I read the Time Standard–“raucous crowd”…a sheriff’s deputy escorting out a man who wouldn’t be quiet. Were there two meetings?

  38. September 3, 2009 at 9:10 am
  39. Anonymous
    September 3, 2009 at 9:59 am

    90% of them were probably on welfare.

  40. Big Al
    September 3, 2009 at 10:05 am

    I was watching the guy who had to go. before it got started he was acting strangely, fidgeting with his hands, eyes darting around, didn’t really make eye contact with anybody that I could tell.
    It was early in the meeting when he had his little freak out.

    He screeched a couple times at somebody speaking. the speaker saying it wasn’t every American’s right to health care, the guy screeched in a high squeak something like “yes it is” and “it is too” when the tall sheriff’s officer was on his way the guy excused himself out the side door…

    There were rounds of applause when people agreed with the speakers and pretty minimal boos of disagreement.

    yes there were passionate feelings represented on both sides. compared to the town hall meetings in other communities I thought it was very well behaved overall.
    There were also some people who’s ideas were on the extreme right and left.

    Somehow there needs to be a certain amount of sensationalizing to sell commercial media may explain your impression of the newspaper story.

  41. September 3, 2009 at 10:07 am

    Kym: There was a touch of raucousity, sure. But me, I went in braced for something like the meltdowns we’ve been seeing on YouTube. Didn’t really happen.

    Couple of crazies, one guy led off by the cops … I think we came in well under par.

  42. Auntie Arkley
    September 3, 2009 at 11:12 am

    Hey you yo yo:

    Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia?

    Did you know that this clause was inserted into the bill on the insistence of two Republican congressmen? The Republicans still won’t vote for the bill, and use THEIR OWN addition to the bill to scare stupid, brainless Americans (Republicans)! Typical dirty Republican scumbag trick.

  43. Eric Kirk
    September 3, 2009 at 12:18 pm

    I can’t believe it was necessary to hold “Town Hall” meetings about national health care. It’s a national issue, for the love of Pete! Not a municipal issue suitable for these so-called Town Hall Meetings.

    Did we need Town Hall Meetings to pass the New Deal? Of course not. Town Hall meeetings are a gimmick, and they backfired on the Obama administration when the insurance mob aggressively took them over.

    I’m actually hoping this has set a precedent for future issues of national significance. I just wish more Republicans would hold them as well. Imagine if we had them in the lead up to the Iraq War.

  44. Eric Kirk
    September 3, 2009 at 12:20 pm

    Well, at least Mike Thompson was honest. He said he was in favor of the “public option”. The public option would eventually result in the government taking over the health care industry.

    Only if the private companies fail to offer something better.

  45. Eric Kirk
    September 3, 2009 at 12:21 pm

    yo yo your mama – which of the five bills are those clips from?

  46. High Finance
    September 3, 2009 at 12:45 pm

    Eric, the private companies (of which there are thousands) will not be able to compete with the public option. The public option will be subsidized by taxpayer dollars. And if you read the bill that passed the House, once you leave your current plan you are required to take the public option only.

    One big problem with these Townhalls. The congressmen do not have them to gauge public opinion & take it into account when they vote on an issue.

    They are held after-the-fact and used to tell people why they voted. Critics are at a huge disadvantage. The congressmen control the mike. They can avoid questions or answer with half-truths. Meanwhile the person who asked the tough question isn’t allowed a follow up.

  47. Reinventing the Wheel
    September 3, 2009 at 1:09 pm

    What successful European business would ever expand to the only industrialized nation on Earth lacking universal health care?

    I thought Thompson was pro-business?

  48. Eric Kirk
    September 3, 2009 at 1:39 pm

    Eric, the private companies (of which there are thousands) will not be able to compete with the public option. The public option will be subsidized by taxpayer dollars. And if you read the bill that passed the House, once you leave your current plan you are required to take the public option only.

    Well, if that’s in one of the three house bills, I doubt it will survive negotiations with the Senate. But if the private companies cannot compete with the public option, then what is the point of trying to protect them? Obviously the public option is better for consumers.

    Incidentally, if you read the Ways and Means bill, you will note that it mandates that the public option be self-sufficient through premiums. So if it’s outcompeting the private companies, it’s because it’s outperforming them, not because it’s backed by tax dollars.

    And I agree the town halls don’t tell the story. So far every major poll shows strong majorities supporting the public option.

    The vote on the final bill is going to be the vote that matters.

  49. Anonymous
    September 3, 2009 at 1:53 pm

    if you read the bill that passed the House, once you leave your current plan you are required to take the public option only.

    Yes, if you read the bill while snorting coke and smokin’ a doobie while pulling back a couple Vat 69s, yeah, sure, that’s what the bill states.

  50. September 3, 2009 at 5:22 pm

    All of the citations cited here are part of a hoax e-mail that is debunked here: http://bit.ly/Ry6Hf. Most e-mails that circulate on this subject contain mis-information, as is the case here.

  51. Anonymous
    September 3, 2009 at 5:24 pm

    One big problem with these Townhalls. The congressmen do not have them to gauge public opinion & take it into account when they vote on an issue.

    They are held after-the-fact and used to tell people why they voted. Critics are at a huge disadvantage. The congressmen control the mike. They can avoid questions or answer with half-truths. Meanwhile the person who asked the tough question isn’t allowed a follow up.

    If a Republican were in office, High Finance wouldn’t be complaining about the town hall format, he’d be defending it.

  52. Anon
    September 3, 2009 at 5:28 pm

    What I thought was so friggin funny was how blatant this whole set-up errrr meeting was; bringing up greenies and Obama clones by the bus full early to stack the room at Redwood Acres- hoping that no one would see it…or the little minion drones hop off the bus and hop into line to kiss the Mikey Thompson live and in person… and if they could not kiss him they could always kiss or spit on Liz Murguia, Bonnie Needless and last but not least Patty Berg.

    Disgusting.

  53. Anonymous
    September 3, 2009 at 5:51 pm

    Those buses must have had a secret parking place because I was there before anybody else and I didn’t see them. Tell us, 5:28. When did your buses arrive? When did they leave? How many were there? What color were they? Did they have California or out-of-state license plates? How many greenies, Obama clones and minions did they bring in? Where did these people come from?

    Oh, and where did you see Patty Berg? I didn’t see her. Gee, I must have missed her.

  54. yo yo your mama's so dumb...
    September 3, 2009 at 6:38 pm

    yo yo your mama is an obvious troll cutting and pasting his/her way across the internet. The other night Jon Stewart confronted an advocate of these same “on page x it says the government can kill your mother” types. The woman was pathetic and had to concede that much of what she “said” was on specific pages (of one of the bills) was actually her twisted interpretation of the language. As Stewart pointed out, a rational person would read the language much differently.

  55. olphart
    September 3, 2009 at 8:31 pm

    I heard that under Obama’s plan if you get a colonoscopy you will get free tickets to a SF Giants game.

  56. Eric Kirk
    September 3, 2009 at 9:18 pm

    I didn’t see any buses. Plenty of cars with liberal bumper stickers. Maybe it would have been more PC if we all took buses. But we didn’t.

  57. Anonymous
    September 3, 2009 at 9:45 pm

    The woman was pathetic

    You forgot the part where she lost her job the very next day. Huh, I can’t imagine why any organization wouldn’t want someone who has such a, umm, creative imagination representing them.

  58. yo yo yo yo mama
    September 4, 2009 at 1:01 am

    in reply to: Auntie Arkley Says

    Im not a republican, they are just as sold out as the democrats. And im not from the insurance industry either, You morons dont realize what this health care take over really is! All you are thinking about is what you are gonna get for free, you dont realize at what cost or what type of care you will get. Please just do some research into what eugenics is! And if you know anything about it you would know its still very active today and is being practiced by the obama adminastration. Please read Ecoscience: Population, Resources, Environment writen by John Holdren. Now this guy is obamas science czar.

    Go read his book here: http://www.questia.com/PM.qst?a=o&d=98156598

    Here is some direct quotes from the book:

    “Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society. ”

    “One way to carry out this disapproval might be to insist that all illegitimate babies be put up for adoption—especially those born to minors, who generally are not capable of caring properly for a child alone. If a single mother really wished to keep her baby, she might be obliged to go through adoption proceedings and demonstrate her ability to support and care for it. Adoption proceedings probably should remain more difficult for single people than for married couples, in recognition of the relative difficulty of raising children alone. It would even be possible to require pregnant single women to marry or have abortions, perhaps as an alternative to placement for adoption, depending on the society. ”

    “Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods is a suggestion that seems to horrify people more than most proposals for involuntary fertility control. Indeed, this would pose some very difficult political, legal, and social questions, to say nothing of the technical problems. No such sterilant exists today, nor does one appear to be under development. To be acceptable, such a substance would have to meet some rather stiff requirements: it must be uniformly effective, despite widely varying doses received by individuals, and despite varying degrees of fertility and sensitivity among individuals; it must be free of dangerous or unpleasant side effects; and it must have no effect on members of the opposite sex, children, old people, pets, or livestock. ”

    “Involuntary fertility control

    A program of sterilizing women after their second or third child, despite the relatively greater difficulty of the operation than vasectomy, might be easier to implement than trying to sterilize men.

    The development of a long-term sterilizing capsule that could be implanted under the skin and removed when pregnancy is desired opens additional possibilities for coercive fertility control. The capsule could be implanted at puberty and might be removable, with official permission, for a limited number of births. ”

    “Toward a Planetary Regime

    Perhaps those agencies, combined with UNEP and the United Nations population agencies, might eventually be developed into a Planetary Regime—sort of an international superagency for population, resources, and environment. Such a comprehensive Planetary Regime could control the development, administration, conservation, and distribution of all natural resources, renewable or nonrenewable, at least insofar as international implications exist. Thus the Regime could have the power to control pollution not only in the atmosphere and oceans, but also in such freshwater bodies as rivers and lakes that cross international boundaries or that discharge into the oceans. The Regime might also be a logical central agency for regulating all international trade, perhaps including assistance from DCs to LDCs, and including all food on the international market.

    The Planetary Regime might be given responsibility for determining the optimum population for the world and for each region and for arbitrating various countries’ shares within their regional limits. Control of population size might remain the responsibility of each government, but the Regime would have some power to enforce the agreed limits. ”

    Well ok, lets hear some real responses. it seems like when folks on this blog get upset they just name call and act childish, can someone actualy debunk me? Do any of you even know what im talking about or will you just ignore this post and keep smoking the obama crack.

    The choice is yours!

  59. Lefty
    September 4, 2009 at 6:36 am

    There were no buses. I arrived at 3:30 and everyone in front of me (with one or two exceptions) was opposed to the plan.(s) Patty Berg was there, I saw her greet Bonnie Neely and Chris Kerrigan. (here come the trolls, here come the trolls!)

    Sometimes I wish there was such a thing as retroactive abortion. I suppose Yo Yo Yo Mama feels the same about me.

  60. 06em
    September 4, 2009 at 6:49 am

    Here’s a real response, yo-yo. Stop getting all your carefully edited “facts” from Glenn Beck – or is it Alex Jones? They both push this garbage by cherry picking quotes from a larger work to make it seem to mean something it doesn’t.

    What your context-deprived quotes from crazytown leave out is that they are from a 1,000+ page college textbook on environmentalism from the late 70’s. This was a time when the topic of overpopulation was very prevalent. The chapter these quotes are contained in is about population control. In the chapter, the authors (Holdren was one of several) survey the methods that could be employed to slow population growth if overpopulation became a calamity. They offer their opinion on whether any of them are practical or desirable. In the end they … alright, I gotta get to work. I’ve cut and pasted what a representative of the reality-based world has to say. Hopefully, it will help innoculate readers from the FOX/PrisonPlanet contagion you insist on being a carrier for:

    In 1977, more than thirty years ago, Holdren was the third author (with Paul and Anne Ehrlich) of a textbook entitled Ecoscience: Population, Resources, and Environment. It was a gigantic tome, fully 1,051 pages in length. In one vast 66 page chapter devoted to “Population Policies,” the authors surveyed a gamut of measures that had been undertaken or considered to control human population growth—including the most extreme. Those included coercive or “involuntary fertility control” measures, such as forced abortions and sterilizations.

    However, to describe these measures is different from advocating them. And in fact, the Ehrlichs and Holdren concluded by arguing that noncoercive measures were what they suppported: “A far better choice, in our view, is to expand the use of milder methods of influencing family size preferences”—such as birth control and access to abortions. In fairness, their text does read as dated today, ripe for quote mining. They were writing in very different times thirty years ago; but even if they were defending these positions then (and they weren’t), that hardly means that they do today.

    Have a nice day.

  61. September 4, 2009 at 7:31 am

    Reinventing the Wheel’s comment was as creative and thoughtful as Yo Yo Your Mama’s copied-and-pasted list was lazy and stupid.

  62. Auntie Arkley
    September 4, 2009 at 10:57 am

    yo yo, get a brain.

  63. Sunny Sentinel
    September 4, 2009 at 5:19 pm

    Yo Yo Your Mama,

    It makes me sad that people actually believe such obvious lies. Let me guess, you’re a dittohead, right?

    Well, in the spirit of regurgitation, let me rebut a sampling of your points with information from Politifact, the Pulitzer Prize winning project of the St. Petersburg Times which fact-checks statements by members of Congress, the White House, lobbyists and interest groups, etc. Yes, I am copying and pasting, but at least it’s from a respected news source, rather than a chain email.

    • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure! False: Section 113 of the bill requires the Health Choices commissioner to conduct a study to make sure health reform does not unintentionally create incentives for businesses to self-insure or create adverse selection in the risk pools of insured plans. There is no mandated audit.

    • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! False: Section 122 outlines broad categories of benefits that must be included in an essential benefits package. It prohibits cost-sharing for preventive care and limits annual out-of-pocket spending to $5,000 for an individual and $10,000 for a family, indexed for inflation. It says nothing about rationing or limiting treatment.

    • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process) Barely True: Section 123 establishes a Health Benefits Advisory Committee that makes recommendations on what types of health insurance coverage will be defined as basic, enhanced or premium. The committee will be chaired by the surgeon general, with members appointed by the president, the comptroller general, and representatives of federal agencies. This committee makes recommendations on insurance regulations, so in that sense it does set standards for benefits. But it does not make decisions about treatments for individuals.

    • Page 42: The “Health Choices Commissioner” will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None. Pants on Fire!: Section 142 outlines the duties of the Health Choices commissioner, who is charged with regulating insurers. The commissioner should seek insurers to offer different types of insurance, including basic, enhanced and premium. Individuals will be able to choose among competing insurers who are regulated via the exchange.

    • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free health care services. Pants on Fire! Section 152 includes a generic nondiscrimination clause, which says insurers may not discriminate with regard to “personal characteristics extraneous to the provision of high quality health care or related services.” It says nothing about “non-US citizens” or immigrants, legal or otherwise. In fact, the legislation specifically states that undocumented aliens will not be eligible for credits to help them buy health insurance, in Section 246 on page 143.

    • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. Barely True: Section 163 sets out goals for electronic health records. It says one goal should be real-time confirmation of which services a person qualifies for and how much they will have to pay. That could be achieved by machine-readable beneficiary cards, according to the legislative language. But the legislation does not require the cards.

    • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. Barely True: Section 163 sets out goals for electronic health records. One of the goals is to include features that “enable electronic funds transfers, in order to allow automated reconciliation” between payment and billing. The legislative summary says the intent in the section is “to adopt standards for typical transactions” between insurance companies and health care providers. The legislation generically describes typical electronic banking transactions and does not outline any special access privileges.

    • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN) . Pants on Fire! Section 164 creates a temporary reinsurance program to help employers or employee associations pay for coverage for workers ages 55 to 64. It does not mention labor unions or community organizer groups, though presumably they could qualify for subsidies like any other employee association that previously offered health insurance. The section’s point, however, is to offer subsidies to employer-based insurance programs, not unions or community organizers.

    • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange. True. Private health care plans must conform to government rules to participate in the exchange, and this page begins an explanation of exchange rules. However, the requirement that insurance companies must conform to is also presented much earlier in the bill. We spotted an earlier reference on page 15, Section 101.

    • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans) . Mostly True. Section 203 sets rules saying that plans must offer basic plans before they can offer plans with extra benefits. These extra benefits are defined as enhanced plans and premium plans. (The unstated assumption here is that enhanced and premium plans will be more profitable for the insurance companies.) But this isn’t the page number that requires health plans to participate in the exchange. Technically speaking, private insurance plans are not required to participate. Rather, only insurance sold on the exchange will satisfy the mandate that people have health insurance. In effect, private health plans that want to sell to individuals will have to sell through the exchange, under the terms of the bill.

    • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens. Half True. Section 204 outlines more regulations for health insurance plans in the exchange. One of the requirements is that they provide “culturally and linguistically appropriate communication and health services.” Another part of the bill mentions that this includes “effective methods for communicating in plain language.” There is no mention of citizenship status.

    • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan. False. Section 205 says the Health Choices commissioner is charged with publicizing the options on the health care exchange. The legislation says the commissioner “may work with other appropriate entities to facilitate the dissemination of information.” The bill does not mention ACORN or Americorps. The bill also says that the commissioner must publicize the “Exchange-participating health benefits plan options,” which would include private insurance plans.

    • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter. False. This page describes people who would qualify for Medicaid, a government insurance program for people with very low incomes. It says that individuals will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid only if they have “not elected to enroll in an Exchange-participating health benefits plan.” So the auto-enrollment only happens if they have not chosen another plan.

    • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No “judicial review” is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed. Barely True. Section 223 discusses how the government will pay doctors under the public option health insurance; they will pay 5 percent more than Medicare pays. It’s true that this section does not set out any sort of judicial review, but it specifically states that health care providers do not have to accept patients under the public option. The bill also says that the Health Choices commissioner has the authority “to correct for payments that are excessive or deficient,” taking into account “amounts paid for similar health care providers and services under other Exchange-participating health benefits plans.” There may be a broader case to be made that the government can outcompete private insurers through the public option, but this section of the plan doesn’t have to do with lawsuits or judicial review.

    • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages. Barely True. Section 225 discusses payments for physicians who choose to accept the public option insurance. Again, there may be a broader case to be made that the government can outcompete private insurers through the public option, but this section of the plan only applies to payments to doctors for patients who are part of the public option. The government does not set wages for doctors because doctors are free to decline to see the patients.

  64. Anonymous
    September 5, 2009 at 12:39 am

    I wonder if there is a strong positive correlation between following the news closely and elevated blood pressure.

  65. 06em
    September 5, 2009 at 7:24 am

    I do know of a study that showed that even tiny amounts of exposure to FOX news and Rush (in the absence of any other news media) caused test subjects bullshit detectors to slow down, stop and, in three cases, begin to run backwards. They shut the study down when one of the researchers was observed doodling pictures of cavemen riding dinosaurs.

  66. Anonymister
    September 5, 2009 at 8:45 am

    Unfortunately, the belligerent goofs who believe what they hear from Fox and Limbaugh will never bother to read the sort of information and rebuttals that Sunny Sentinel posted.

  67. September 5, 2009 at 3:51 pm

    No, but those “goofs” as you call them are happy to be ignorant, load, and toting guns. It would be funny if it wasn’t scary. I’ve been covering this crap on my blog, and have gotten lots of e-mails from people. Ironic that the people benefiting from Medicare are the same ones speaking out against health care reform, isn’t it?

  68. franklin
    September 5, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    Big Al said, “I was watching the guy who had to go. before it got started he was acting strangely, fidgeting with his hands, eyes darting around, didn’t really make eye contact with anybody that I could tell.”

    “It was early in the meeting when he had his little freak out.”

    I was just a row or two in front of this person; I didn’t notice anything odd about him when I came in and sat down or occasionally glanced around. I did hear him start to protest, increasingly vocally, when someone repeatedly stated that health care is not a human right. From close up, I had the distinct impression that the man was in deep emotional pain and simply unable to contain himself upon hearing such baldly inhumane comments.

  69. September 5, 2009 at 9:16 pm

    Mr. Thompson did say that all 3 bills in the House contain a privision that would require everyone to purchase insurance.
    If the public option doesn’t survive, where does that leave us? Buying insurance from private companies.
    How does this fix anything?

  70. Walt
    September 5, 2009 at 9:32 pm

    The richer get richer and some wealth tinkles down on us. . .or was that rain?

  71. Big Al
    September 5, 2009 at 10:33 pm

    “some wealth tinkles down on us. . .or was that rain?”

    always seemed like a “golden shower” to me…

  72. Anonymister
    September 6, 2009 at 7:16 am

    Why should I support Democrats who promise reforms, but behave like Republicans?

  73. Anonymous
    September 6, 2009 at 11:46 am

    Trickles! Not “tinkles.”

  74. Anonymous
    September 6, 2009 at 11:47 am

    Ronald Reagan wanted the wealthy to trickle down their wealth upon the poor. Not tinkle down their pee upon the peons. Or at least, that’s what he said.

  75. Anonymous
    September 7, 2009 at 7:57 pm

    What’s worse is a republican governor acting like a democrat. Radical BS flushing Ca down the crabber. Just like baykeeper,epic,nec,hwc are doing to humboldt.

  76. September 8, 2009 at 4:48 pm

    Access Humboldt has archived the video of the meeting:

    http://www.archive.org/details/AH-thompson

    Call Access and thank them for this free service, 476-1798.

  77. Anonymous
    September 9, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Thanks for that link!

  78. Tea Party Gal
    November 12, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    Thanks yo-yo your mama for citing the problems with HR3200. Additionally, thank you Sunny Sentinel for fact checking with Politifact (whatever), most of those problems were shown to be true.

    The ones you (they) found to be false were your (their) interpretation. The wording makes it unclear how our GOV will screw us over.

    HR 3962 is even worse. Read for yourself:
    http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3962/show

    The net result is that millions upon millions of Americans will be dumped into a GOV policy as small businesses will opt for 8% tax rather than wrestle with the GOV for all the mandates they will be required to provide.

    Check our Hawaii as the tried to insure children. Check out MASS. as they wrestle rationing versus cost over-runs. Check out Maine as their good intentions still leave most uninsured without insurance.

    Why are we insisting that our GOV take care of us when they are incapable? Folks, its up to us to fix this.

  79. Tea Party Gal
    November 12, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    True Health Care Reform Ideas
    These ideas are submitted by a Mom with no affiliation with the health care industry or our government.

    • All health care reform needs to be patient and doctor centered.
    • Limit tort reform – mediation and arbitration before litigation and out-of-court settlements.
    • Allow access to all health insurance across state lines, we can pick and choose whatever policy we need.
    • Eliminate waste, fraud and abuse FIRST, then audit all transactions in Medicare/Medical before layering on additionally programs.
    • Medicare/Medical needs to pay “market average” reimbursements.
    • Medicare/Medical recipients need to pay taxes on the free gov’t services they receive based on a net worth sliding scale.
    • No government funded Co-ops or new taxpayer funded health insurance. Free market options only and that includes non-profit.
    • Chronic illness sufferers can form like-illness cooperatives for the latest and lowest cost treatments and medicines.
    • Government funded medical research where patents are held by the government. Treatments, innovations, and medicines are licensed to private industry to compete on price in the market place.
    • Provide incentives or subsidies for health savings accounts for every American.
    • Focus on catastrophic insurance mandates that can expand/change based upon needs.
    • Regulate the mark-up margins for prescriptions drugs, imaging, and diagnostic medicine.
    • Include customary alternative medicine, like acupuncture, herbal remedies, supplemental therapies, chiropractic care, etc within health care system.
    • Subsidize Urgent Care Clinics to minimize unnecessary emergency care, especially weekends and after-hours.
    • Fund public health clinics to provide affordable, sliding scale wellness/prevention health care.
    • No free illegal alien or immigrant services, they must pay for their own health care.
    • No taxpayer funded abortions, period!
    • Implement a MediCore program– a public service doctor and nurse program, where the gov’t pays tuition to medical school in exchange for 4-7 years of medical service to public health clinics, low income or as designated other areas.
    • Require that all medical services and drug stores post their fees up front, so we can “shop” for low cost services and medicine.
    • Every government employee must have the same health care plans as any other paying American. No better, no worse.

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