Home > marijuana > Redwood ACLU Questions Arcata’s Anti-Protest Practices

Redwood ACLU Questions Arcata’s Anti-Protest Practices

[ACLU press release]

Annual 4/20 pro-marijuana legalization demonstration draws concern

For the first time in a long time, Redwood Park did NOT look like this on 4/20.

The Board of Directors of the Redwood Chapter, American Civil Liberties Union expressed concern today over the pattern of practices by City of Arcata officials in relation to the annual “4/20” marijuana legalization protest in Redwood Park, which falls every year on April 20th.

In particular, Redwood ACLU Boardmembers and other community members have witnessed a number of peculiar actions over the last couple of years by Arcata Police Department officers and other city staff. These include:

  • The erection of roadblocks on public streets leading to Redwood Park; and,
  • The blocking of public trails through public parkland leading to Redwood Park; and,
  • The shutdown of public parking lots and public restrooms; and,
  • The marching of a platoon of armed APD officers through Redwood Park to harass and intimidate college students and others engaged in peaceful protest, barking orders at them concerning the “trampling of foliage” and other nuisance-level complaints; and,
  • The ticketing of members of the public in an arbitrary and capricious manner.

“The over-reaction of the City of Arcata to what amounts to a low-impact, non-violent mass action to protest federal law is really uncalled for,” Vice Chair Jack Munsee said. “It’s possibly unconstitutional — you have the right to peacefully protest.”

Redwood ACLU Boardmembers will be on hand tomorrow to act as observers.

The Redwood Chapter, ACLU represents over 850 ACLU members across Del Norte, Humboldt, Western Trinity and Northern Mendocino Counties. Their offices are located at 917 Third Street in Old Town Eureka. For more information, call the Redwood ACLU at (707) 442-4419 or visit redwoodaclu.blogspot.com.

  1. RAMDX
    April 21, 2011 at 9:55 am

    The city of Arcata feels that a 4/20 gathering of people in the park will have a bad environmental effect. It seems to be a police state tactic to me.

    There are still ways to get into the park, but it involves planning and hiking. The rain and slippery trails kept me away this year. I’ll be back, though, next year.

  2. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 10:04 am

    “Tomorrow”? It was yesterday.

  3. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 10:04 am

    mass action to protest federal law

    4/20 is a federal protest? I’d love for them to bring this argument in court, just to see the judge laugh at them. The local ACLU, unfortunately, has lost all credibility.

  4. Roger McFerris
    April 21, 2011 at 10:06 am

    To bad the City of Arcata is trying to stop this. As a small business owner in Arcata, i could tell that sales were up directly related to this event. Many of our customers were from areas outside the County. Perhaps Humboldt County NORML could file a permit with the city next year to host the event? I understand that the insurance would be the main obstacle.

  5. 69er
    April 21, 2011 at 10:09 am

    Good for Chief Chapman, about time someone had the guts to take a stand against a bunch of dweebs that destroy and desecrate the very things they swear they are protecting when they trespass and sit in the trees. If they want to destroy their own bodies in private they are welcome to it.

  6. RAMDX
    April 21, 2011 at 10:16 am

    Who sits in the trees? How do people trespass in a public park? 69er, you’re a moron.

  7. 69er
    April 21, 2011 at 10:19 am

    Roger McFerris, who in hell are you trying to kid. You know it is an entirely illegal activity. Only those with permission from their Drs. would be legal and most of those are phonies that get the prescriptions only to legalise their pot smoking.

  8. 69er
    April 21, 2011 at 10:22 am

    Same people doing the same things, tree sitters, pot smokers, bypass protesters, all the same ilk.

  9. "HENCHMAN OF JUSTICE"
    April 21, 2011 at 10:28 am

    People have a right to peacefully protest AND STILL be capable of doing other things in a sorta “in and out” fashion during the event like, oh, lets go take a walk on a public trail WHERE no policy exists that limits the number of users at one time or any given time to use a public trail – (sarcasm~ It is an Easter Egg Hunt looking for the occupancy signs on public trails…. like the fire department requires for users in public buildings…. So, it is pretty difficult to say that “A USER” can’t enjoy the many recreational activities that just so happen to be located within near proximity to each other; and, as if the “restrictions” don’t place a burden on society by and through the old “use the minority to usurp the majority, intentionally or not” type of tactic to “marshalize law” in any given section, district, ward or other area of a municipality or area covered by charter.

    Must be a funding problem – who do ya charge when people just show-up willy nilly……no application process, no potential permit fees, no regulation controls and powers, no ability to include other government code sections, etc….

    Yet, there is still the ability to enforce the current laws on the books like disorderly conducts, public ludities, excessive harassments, etc….; and, to offer emergency service on the fly just like normal in process, but difficult on the scene.

    Good job to the local chapter for raising the awareness to this issue as it seems more than just a DUI checkpoint, but a total lockdown, Marshal Lawesque. It is unfortunate because I don’t believe myself that the city is doing it wrecklessly, but it is nonetheless a trampling on some of the users of that public facility no matter which way any defensive arguments tend to sway.

    Neighbors in that area have concerns for their own parking needs, privacy issues, property damages, noise pollutions, infrastructure recouping for damages, peace officer observations/oversites, fire and emergency access and staging areas, so many things that the city has a valid concern…… in short,

    “….can’t we all just get along?” – R. King

    Jeffrey Lytle
    McKinleyville – 5th District

  10. Omnomnonimous
    April 21, 2011 at 10:30 am

    They just need to come up with a different place to have this event. Simple fact of the matter is it has happened at great cost to the City in prior years as there is no denying the impact all those feet have on wet ground so early in the spring.

    I’m all for pushing the federal government to cease a demonstrably stupid prohibition of a mostly harmless plant, but there’s got to be a place where common sense, decency, and the 1st Amendment can get together without physically making such a mess of things. This particular protest has always had an air of clueless petulance about it, which doesn’t exactly lend it much credibility anyway. A bit of respect would go a long way toward fixing that.

  11. RAMDX
    April 21, 2011 at 10:34 am

    What’s a “bypass protester”?

  12. Not A Native
    April 21, 2011 at 10:40 am

    Dunno, I’d call the 420 actions peaceful civil disobedience. Carrying less than one ounce of pot is now an infraction in CA. As to the city closing down the park, thats not the best way to handle it, instead they should advise the public how to be there responsibly. Don’t see any concern that the Saturday farmer’s market harms the grass on the plaza. Don’t think 420 has anything to do with medical pot, its only about recreational pot, like prop 23 on the last election.

  13. skippy
    April 21, 2011 at 10:40 am

    “Dozens of people leave Redwood Park after Arcata Park Ranger Kevin Stonebarger ordered them to leave, saying that the park was closed due to maintenance in Arcata on Wednesday. No maintenance was being performed at that time, and the park was not closed.”/i>

    More in today’s Times-Standard article by Allison Edrington while North Coast Journal’s Bob Doran added his article, photos, and a 4 minute video interview with APD Chief Chapman.

    Yours truly is aware that APD asked one local landlord about using his plaza business and overlooking office windows for surveillance purposes onto the street and alley. Really? This 4/20 stuff must be really getting out of hand if these sorts of measures are being undertaken.

    In related news, Kevin Hoover had some photos and text yesterday of Arcata’s recent 40,000 watt and child endangerment bust he covered. It’s hard to keep up these days. That’s a lot of wattage. Arcata’s black market seems to be thriving despite medical legalization, even in this unusual and tony California Avenue neighborhood.

  14. "HENCHMAN OF JUSTICE"
    April 21, 2011 at 10:40 am

    10:30 am,

    What you explain is good because it validates the hypocrisy of people who moan and groan over certain and specific environmental impacts or destructions, but can’t grasp the cumulative, heavy loaded post traumatic effects created by mass collectivenesses in similar ideologies emmigrating to a confined space in a “non-everyday” fashion – it is as if these environmentalists are being confronted with the light-of-day revelation of understanding true philosphical beliefs(environmentalisms), but can’t practice it due to dumbfoundednesses created by emotional greeds, popularisms, attention getting, etc…. kinda lameoid in a way by the mass protestors, kinda like WoodStock, all earth and love and…..TRASH. The real trash is the trash that leaves the trash, yet, the trash types could never admit they are trash, nor even clean-up their trash or fix their damages, collectively or as individuals.

    JL

  15. "HENCHMAN OF JUSTICE"
    April 21, 2011 at 10:42 am

    NAN,

    Farmers are permitted to do so, so service has been paid for, if needed. Just sayin’.

    JL

  16. What Now
    April 21, 2011 at 10:46 am

    “69er says:
    April 21, 2011 at 10:19 am
    ….. Only those with permission from their Drs. would be legal and most of those are phonies that get the prescriptions only to legalise their pot smoking…”

    Terrific!
    We have a trained medical professional that’s a chronic member of the posting community and able to second guess the diagnosis and treatment of OTHER professionals without even having to review the specifics of the case!
    Surely, an example of a richly endowed psychic remote viewer.
    This blog surely has one of the richest bevy of contributors around.

  17. neomoderate
    April 21, 2011 at 11:05 am

    That many feet would have trashed the park – it’s practically a marsh right now. If they want to pay to rehab it, great, otherwise move along.

  18. Patrick Henry
    April 21, 2011 at 11:17 am

    Great! Pot was illegal in the 90’s and people gathered in the park in great numbers to celebrate their freedom (something every tyrant on earth would be against and their soldiers would “Tiananmen Square” them). Now that Arnold and the California legislature has made it an infraction less than a cross-walking ticket, Arcata cracks down on Freedom. Progressive Arcata? History! Welcome to the liberal merchant-class ruling elite. Shame on you Arcata Police, City Manager and City Council, shame on you! Fakes and phonies all of them.

  19. April 21, 2011 at 11:22 am

    According to the caption on the Times Standard page one photo:

    (aptly named) Ranger Stonebarger (APD) “ordered” people to leave “saying the park was closed due to maintenance” but that the park was in fact NOT closed and that no maintenance was being preformed.

    It sounds a bit to me like the infamous Kern County Sheriff Roy Galyn, who admitted he arrested people not because they had done anything wrong but because they appeared “ready to violate the law.” and was then admonished by Robert Kennedy to go read the Constitution.

    Robert Kennedy’s first trip to see Chavez in Delano, California, began with a public hearing on the standoff between striking grape pickers and law enforcement, and it got his blood up. During the questioning of a sheriff who admitted to arresting strikers who looked “ready to violate the law,” Kennedy shot back, “May I suggest that during the luncheon period of time that the sheriff and the district attorney read the Constitution of the United States?” Journalist Jack Newfield, who repeatedly saw Kennedy affected by face-to-face encounters with injustice, puts it well: “It took the experience of the hearings to let his head catch up with his heart.”

  20. High Finance
    April 21, 2011 at 11:46 am

    You don’t need to be a doctor to know that quacks are running around issuing 215 cards to anybody with $65 “What Now”.

    You just have to open your eyes & use your brain.

  21. Patrick Henry
    April 21, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    *High* Fi 11:46 Russia, Saudi Arabia, and United Arab Emirates agree with you “Even the smallest amounts of the drug can lead to a mandatory four year prison sentence.” European countries and many American states as well as many other democracies in the world disagree with you. Birds of a feather …

  22. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    Poor HiFi is sounding increasingly tortured by his cognitive dissonance, sinking to the point where he can’t make a logical argument – just keeps telling people to use their brains, tosses out unsubstantiated claims and adds nothing to the discussion. What would he do if he had to have a doctor’s prescription for his doses of Jim Beam, or whatever rot gut is his drug of choice?

  23. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 12:12 pm

    It sounds a bit to me like the infamous Kern County Sheriff Roy Galyn

    Actually, it sounds nothing like the Kern County sheriff. By your own admission, that incident involved arrests. Who was arrested for merely going to Redwood Park yesterday? No one.

    Have you sued Arcata yet? Enough with the hyperbole.

  24. Patrick Henry
    April 21, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    Anon 2:12 Right! There’s no difference between police arresting people and rows of cops with billy clubs threatening to arrest people. What in the hell happened to people’s belief in Freedom? Freedom for people who “think like me” is Fascism!

  25. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    From CDC:

    Alcohol:
    Alcohol is one of the most widely used drug substances in the world. Alcohol use and binge drinking among our nation’s youth is a major public health problem:

    Alcohol is used by more young people in the United States than tobacco or illicit drugs.1
    Excessive alcohol consumption is associated with approximately 75,000 deaths per year.2
    Alcohol is a factor in approximately 41% of all deaths from motor vehicle crashes.3
    Among youth, the use of alcohol and other drugs has been linked to unintentional injuries, physical fights, academic and occupational problems, and illegal behavior.4
    Long-term alcohol misuse is associated with liver disease, cancer, cardiovascular disease, and neurological damage as well as psychiatric problems such as depression, anxiety, and antisocial personality disorder.5
    Drug use contributes directly and indirectly to the HIV epidemic, and alcohol and drug use contribute markedly to infant morbidity and mortality.5

    Marijuana:
    Marijuana is the most commonly used illicit drug among youth in the United States.9 Current marijuana use decreased from 27% in 1999 to 21% in 2009.6

    Prescription & Over-the-Counter Drug Abuse”
    While illicit drug use has declined among youth, rates of nonmedical use of prescription and over-the-counter (OTC) medication remain high.9 Prescription medications most commonly abused by youth include pain relievers, tranquilizers, stimulants, and depressants.9 In 2009, 20% of U.S. high school students had ever taken a prescription drug, such as Oxycontin, Percocet, Vicodin, Adderall, Ritalin, or Xanax, without a doctor’s prescription.6 Teens also misuse OTC cough and cold medications, containing the cough suppressant dextromethorphan (DXM), to get high.10 Prescription and OTC medications are widely available, free or inexpensive, and falsely believed to be safer than illicit drugs. Misuse of prescription and OTC medications can cause serious health effects, addiction, and death.10,11

  26. Patrick Henry
    April 21, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    PJ 12:19 So why do Humboldt County schools, including elementary schools, have beer or wine fundraisers? Do as we say, not as we do? We’re all MADD but a little fundraiser for the Kindergarten is cool, right?

  27. Mark Sailors
    April 21, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    “(aptly named) Ranger Stonebarger (APD) “ordered” people to leave “saying the park was closed due to maintenance” but that the park was in fact NOT closed and that no maintenance was being preformed.”

    That is not exactly what was said.
    I was there.
    The police told people that the north driveway to the park was closed, and so were the trails in that area BECAUSE they were trimming trees and there were 8 foot long branches falling on the road and trail.
    I was standing there when Chief Chapman was explaining it to someone that was pissed off that they were “lied” to.

    There were big signs around warning people that the park was NON SMOKING. That means cannabis as well as tobacco. It is never legal to have a loose dog in Redwood park, it is never legal to go off trail, it is never legal to smoke ANYTHING there.
    Look for the upcoming photos.

  28. Mark Sailors
    April 21, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    “High Finance says:
    April 21, 2011 at 11:46 am

    You don’t need to be a doctor to know that quacks are running around issuing 215 cards to anybody with $65 “What Now”.

    You just have to open your eyes & use your brain.”

    Wanna bet you can find 100 doctors that will write you a prescription of anti depressants, pain killers (opiates), and social anxiety medications for every 1 doctor that writes medical cannabis recommendations?

    Try using the part of your brain that does not run on fear.

  29. Mark Sailors
    April 21, 2011 at 12:39 pm

    >>>>>>Should have read “for” anti depressants not “OF”.
    May bad.

  30. April 21, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    Just legalize it already. What waste of time and money.

  31. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    That’s a good point, Mark Sailors. Virtually every doctor writes those prescriptions, many of which are resold in the street market, while the doctors who will write prescriptions for mj are rare. Alcohol, no prescription required – just a friend over 21 to procure – kills more people than all the illicit drugs combined, costs trillions in health care and lost wages, destroys families, contributes to unprotected sex and teenage pregnancy, and is the most abused drug by people of all ages. It also has the distinction of being the leading “gateway drug.”

  32. Mark Sailors
    April 21, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    I would argue that the number one gateway drug is refined sugar, as it acts on the same part of the brain as cocaine and has been proven to be a pain reliever.

  33. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    A gateway drug is one which when used makes a user more likely to use another drug. If I’ve been smoking weed and someone offers me cocaine, nothing about being high on weed is going to make me likely to want to try cocaine. If I’ve been consuming sugar, again, no likelihood of my wanting to do the cocaine. If I’m drunk, my inhibitions may be low enough and I may in fact be in a blackout state and as a result, be the most receptive to trying cocaine. Sugar and weed are drugs but for anyone to call either one a gateway drug is laughable.

  34. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    Is it even possible to get as messed up on pot as alcohol? I’ve never seen anyone high on pot as out of control as a drunk.

  35. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    And let me be clear, I have enjoyed both the buzz of alcohol and pot and imbibed neither for their taste.

  36. Tommy Chong
    April 21, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    I’m with Rose!

  37. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    I’m with Rose!

  38. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    i agree with rose for once.

  39. What Now
    April 21, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    Mark Sailors addresses High Finance
    April 21, 2011 at 12:38 pm :

    “Try using the part of your brain that does not run on fear.”
    Unfortunately Mark,the only parts left would be the narcicism component,the glutton component and snark center.
    Kharsakov’s syndrome burned-out the rest in that pathetic bloke.

  40. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 2:58 pm

    Marijuana can have serious damaging impact on people (especially young people) who have Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder.

  41. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    Yes, only give your “ADHD” kids high grade pharmaceutical speed!! 8X

  42. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    And then express dismay over the growing number of speed freaks.

  43. Johnny Cambridge
    April 21, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    As much as I am for the reform of marijuana laws, I find it very difficult to see the 4/20 gathering as a protest. Its a bunch of people getting high.

    Organised, peaceful protests ARE constitutionally protected… But public intoxication is not. If you want to protest the laws, do it… But that doesn’t mean taking over a park, tearing up the grass, littering, and getting high in public.

    Even if smoking pot were legal, I still wouldn’t think it should be allowed consumed in public.

  44. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    I agree with the person who said pot can be dangerous for kids with hyperactivity disorders. And sorry, but uppers like speed actually have the reverse effect, and to me, are safer. A prescribed upper is worth looking into. My cousin’s kid went from suicidal to clarity. She finally understood the feeling of control and order in her brain after trying ritalin. For some kids it is a godsend.

  45. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    The problem arises as they reach adolescence and they start reacting to it like an adult would – it’s speed. Btw, no one is advocating any sort of drugs for children.

  46. Charlie Bean
    April 21, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    Patrick Henry says:

    April 21, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    Patrick Henry: “PJ 12:19 So why do Humboldt County schools, including elementary schools, have beer or wine fundraisers? Do as we say, not as we do? We’re all MADD but a little fundraiser for the Kindergarten is cool, right?”

    Humboldt County Schools, or just oner school, St. Bernards? Only one I heard of.

  47. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 5:13 pm

    I know Cutten has done that for a number of years, CB / PH. I prefer ice cream socials and carnivals, pancake breakfasts and spaghetti feeds with raffles to beer and wine tastings for school fund raisers, especially when they encourage children to attend. Even St. Bernards Monte Carlo and bingo is preferable.

  48. RAMDX
    April 21, 2011 at 6:04 pm

    The Eureka teen center recently held a fund raising brunch that featured mimosas.

  49. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 6:23 pm

    Hey! Fuxx you SOBs! Ritalin is NOT the only treatment for ADHD! Morons!

  50. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 6:45 pm

    So why do Humboldt County schools, including elementary schools, have beer or wine fundraisers?

    Show me a single school that holds a beer or wine fundraiser. These events are hosted by nonprofit parent groups off school grounds. The events are for-adults-only, sometimes feature off-site childcare, and are about responsible drinking — and usually alcohol is not the focus of the event. The events are usually dinner-and-auction scenarios. To answer your question though, it’s done because school budgets have been tossed into a shredder for 5 to 10 years now. These events raise a lot of money and help reduce the bleeding out of one or two staff positions.

  51. Duh !
    April 21, 2011 at 8:17 pm

    In HumCo, the only certain way to get a crowd is to feature beer and rock n’ roll. Works every time because its what people think going out for entertainment means.

  52. Ponder z
    April 21, 2011 at 9:03 pm

    It has been suggested that marijuana is at the root of many mental disorders, including acute toxic psychosis, panic attacks (one of the very conditions it is being used experimentally to treat), flashbacks, delusions, depersonalization, hallucinations, paranoia, depression, and uncontrollable aggressiveness. Marijuana has long been known to trigger attacks of mental illness, such as bipolar (manic-depressive) psychosis and schizophrenia. This connection with mental illness should make health care providers for terminally ill patients and the patients themselves, who may already be suffering from some form of clinical depression, weigh very carefully the pros and cons of adopting a therapeutic course of marijuana.

    In the short term, marijuana use impairs perception, judgment, thinking, memory, and learning; memory defects may persist six weeks after last use. Mental disorders connected with marijuana use merit their own category in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) IV, published by the American Psychiatric Association. These include Cannabis Intoxication (consisting of impaired motor coordination, anxiety, impaired judgment, sensation of slowed time, social withdrawal, and often includes perceptual disturbances; Cannabis Intoxication Delirium (memory deficit, disorientation); Cannabis Induced Psychotic Disorder, Delusions; Cannabis Induced Psychotic Disorder, Hallucinations; and Cannabis Induced Anxiety Disorder.

    In addition, marijuana use has many indirect effects on health. Its effect on coordination, perception, and judgment means that it causes a number of accidents, vehicular and otherwise.

    For further information, you may find the following sites helpful:

    http://www.sarnia.com/GROUPS/ANTIDRUG/reality/updatejl.html, for information on links between marijuana use and mental health risks.
    http://www.sarnia.com/GROUPS/ANTIDRUG/mrr/21.96.10.html, for more information on the indirect effects of marijuana on health
    http://www.adf.org.au/drughit, the Australian Drug Foundation�s website
    http://marijuananews.com/a_safe_ high_.htm, a reprint of New Science magazine�s “Marijuana Special Report: A Safe High?” with commentary
    http://marijuananews.com/claim_four.htm, an article about the similarity of long-term marijuana use�s effect on the brain to that of “hard” drugs, with commentary
    http://www.drugs.indiana.edu/publications/iprc/misc/smokescreen.html, for general information on the health risks of marijuana.
    http://www.health.org, the homepage of the National Clearinghouse on Alcohol and Drug Information, for general information on marijuana.

  53. Ponder z
    April 21, 2011 at 9:06 pm

    The effects of marijuana use on the brain are very similar to the effects of heroin, alcohol or cocaine. According to the National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA), withdrawal from THC, pot’s active ingredient, inhibits the activity of the body’s natural anti-stress hormone, dopamine. Damage to the dopamine neuron can result in the onset of deep depression, anxiety and personality disturbances.

    Due to the regeneration of THC over the past few decades, marijuana is far more potent today than it was in the 1960s and 1970s.

    Thomas Pasquarella of the Drug Enforcement Agency discussed this recently at the Family University at Joel Barlow High School, sponsored by the Easton-Redding Community Coalition (ERCC), in conjunction with the Redding and Easton schools’ PTAs.

    Pasquarella made clear that in addition to being highly potent, marijuana today is frequently laced with potentially instantly lethal substances, including rat poison and the “club drug” ecstasy. (Note that ecstasy and similarly manufactured “club drugs,” are derived from horse tranquilizers).

    Usage carries severe short- and long-term health consequences.

    When someone smokes pot, THC passes rapidly through the lungs into the bloodstream, where it travels to the body’s organs, including the brain.

    Short-term effects of marijuana use include problems with memory and learning, difficulty in thinking and problem-solving, loss of coordination and increased heart rate.

    Research findings for long-term use are similar to those of so-called “harder” drugs.

    According to the NIDA, a user’s risk of heart attack more than quadruples in the first hour after smoking marijuana.

    Further, a study of 450 individuals who smoked marijuana frequently but did not smoke tobacco reported significantly more health problems and missed more days of work than nonsmokers.

    Even infrequent use can cause burning and stinging of the mouth and throat, often accompanied by a heavy cough.

    Someone who smokes marijuana frequently has many of the same respiratory problems as cigarette smokers, including lung cancer

    The NIDA cites many studies reporting that students who smoke pot frequently get lower grades and are less likely to graduate from high school compared to their non-using peers.

    A study of 129 college students found that those who used marijuana heavily (27 out of 30 days) had far inferior cognitive skills related to attention, memory and learning. As a result, stated the NIDA, heavy users may be functioning at a reduced intellectual level all of the time.

    Marijuana is the top drug of choice among Americans; according to the NIDA, and 60 percent of youth under 21 use marijuana more than any other illicit drug.

    Marijuana is often mistaken as a more “socially acceptable” alternative to “harder” substances like heroin and cocaine – but as we know, the effects on the body are alarmingly alike.

    Remember, even experimen­tation can lead to addiction.

    According to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, more teens are in treatment with a primary diagnosis of marijuana dependence than all other illicit drugs combined.

    So, be clear that today’s marijuana is not the pot smoked by earlier generations. It is addictive and horribly damaging to one’s physical and mental health and intellectual capacity.

    Don’t be fooled by the exploits of fun-loving celluloid “stoners.” And don’t think just because your parents may have smoked marijuana, that it’s okay for you. It’s not – the price is just too high.

    This column reflects the opinion of Editor Larissa Lytwyn and does not necessarily represent the views of Hometown Publications.

    Source: Easton Courier (CT)
    Author: Larissa Lytwyn
    Published: May 26, 2005
    Copyright: 2005 Easton Courier
    Contact: eastoncourier@add-inc.com
    Website: http://www.eastoncourier.com/

    Related Articles:

    War on Drugs Gone To Pot
    http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread20691.shtml

    The War on Pot: Wrong Drug, Wrong War
    http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread20674.shtml

    Marijuana Becomes Focus of Drug War
    http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread20619.shtml

  54. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    “It has been suggested” that people who post long copy / pastes of dubious claims may need to smoke a little pot and chill the f–k out.

  55. Ponder z
    April 21, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    The Eureka Fire Department discovered a large marijuana growing operation while responding to a warehouse fire on Tuesday night.

    According to a Eureka Police Department press release, the fire department responded to the warehouse at 9:09 p.m. Tuesday on the 1800 block of Third Street in Eureka after a power box on the side of the building had caught fire.

    Fire personnel discovered a large marijuana growing operation and a white Ford F350 Superduty pickup truck with a dog inside it inside the warehouse.

    Eureka police and the Problem Oriented Policing Unit (POP) was called out to assist with the marijuana grow.

    POP detectives executed a search warrant and located 814 marijuana plants, ranging in size from approximately 6 inches to 4 feet, or 115.5 pounds bulk weight of “wet weed,” according to the EPD. The marijuana crops were divided into three rooms serviced by 28 operational grow lights, estimated at 1,000 watts each.

    The EPD said the Ford F350 Superduty truck’s bed contained several growing marijuana plants and spilled potting soil.

    Based on evidence found at the scene, detectives believe this was an ongoing, long-term commercial marijuana cultivation operation. The investigation is continuing, and investigators are following up on several leads that may result in one or more arrests.

  56. Ponder z
    April 21, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    yea, like that bullshit at 12:19. are you chilled now?

  57. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 9:42 pm

    My 12:19 post was excerpts from CDC. You know, (but probably you don’t) Center for Disease Control, not a completely BS essay from an editorial “suggesting” there might be negative side effects when crazy people use drugs. Sounds like you got your panties in a bunch over your drug of choice (alcohol) being the drug that is abused the most by all age groups and does the most harm.

  58. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    Who said ritalin is the only ADHD drug? There are lots of them, and some work for some kids. Gee Whiz. Don’t knock it until you’ve been faced with it.

  59. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    I am not sorry I lost my temper. It pisses me off when people get their kicks throwing one-liners around about a condition, ADHD, that has affected my whole fuxxing life!

  60. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    ADHD also affects adults. Marijuana is bad for them too.

  61. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 10:03 pm

    My husband and child have it. I struggle every day trying to help them. I agree 9:51. I didn’t read that comment the same way you did. I think pot is bad for AD/HD and I think certain prescribed drugs can help, though my family has not tried it.

  62. What Now
    April 21, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    “Plain Jane says:
    April 21, 2011 at 9:19 pm
    “It has been suggested” that people who post long copy / pastes of dubious claims may need to smoke a little pot and chill the f–k out.”
    PJ, bless your heart,you made my week with that one.
    Got a terrific chuckle from it.
    Thanks!

  63. AADD is me
    April 21, 2011 at 10:20 pm

    AADD is a bitch, can’t focus on dull repetitive chores, which is what most work is….

    burn a fatty and I can keep from being debilitated dreaming about things and get down and do my work.

  64. Plain Jane
    April 21, 2011 at 10:48 pm

    Michael Pollan, in his book “The Botony of Desire,” discusses that phenomenon, AADD. Pot narrows and intensifies focus on the “job” at hand, whatever that might be, and dims extraneous stimuli.

  65. tra
    April 21, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Re: the Marijauana warehouse grow fire —

    A perfect example of one of the negative effects caused by cannabis Prohibition. Just like the fires that were caused by moonshiners’ distilling operations during alcohol Prohibition. Don’t hear about too many of those fires these days, do you?

  66. AADD is me
    April 21, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    yea, ha, the ol’lady says “go smoke some and get to work!”
    and I do….

  67. Anon
    April 21, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    The Trillium thanks the City of Arcata. Who speaks for the flowers that are thoughtlessly trampled year after year by stoned youth? Not the ACLU.

  68. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 11:28 pm

    That’s because the ACLU is about “civil liberties.” Root word being civitas, the people. And since when are there flowers anywhere in sight there? Grass, redwood trees and ferns are all that’s in sight.

  69. Anonymous
    April 21, 2011 at 11:36 pm

    Whether you love pot, you hate pot or you don’t give a damn about pot, legalization still makes the most sense.

  70. FurtureResident
    April 22, 2011 at 5:55 am

    Welcome to modern America. We (Government) sends air power for ground support to Libya, Egypt, etc. to provide a means for peaceful protest but we citizens can’t do the same here on US soil! Reminds me of the last condo meeting I attended. We were all not allowed to speak. My only thought was of all those men and women that put their lives on the line for America and freedom. Only to end up voiceless & homeless.
    Dr. King’s divide on poverty and wealth has only just begun! If we Americans don’t snap out of it and hold those in offices accountable we are all doomed.

  71. Ponder z
    April 22, 2011 at 6:04 am

    I deal with stoners every day, and this is what I see. They all have a prescription form a fake Doctor. They are lazy dope smokers who are a waste to society. They contribute nothing to the economy, just use its free services. I pass the time by messing with their heads, because I am bored with their bullshit. The following is exactly why chronic dope smokers have brain damage.

    THC affects the nerve cells in the part of the brain where memories are formed. This makes it hard for the user to recall recent events (such as what happened a few minutes ago). It is hard to learn while high – a working short-term memory is required for learning and performing tasks that call for more than one or two steps.
    Among a group of long-time heavy marijuana users in Costa Rica, researchers found that the people had great trouble when asked to recall a short list of words (a standard test of memory). People in that study group also found it very hard to focus their attention on the tests given to them.

    As people age, they normally lose nerve cells in a region of the brain that is important for remembering events. Chronic exposure to THC may hasten the age-related loss of these nerve cells. In one study, researchers found that rats exposed to THC every day for 8 months (about 1/3 of their lifespan), showed a loss of brain cells comparable to rats that were twice their age.

    It is not known whether a similar effect occurs in humans. Researchers are still learning about the many ways that marijuana could affect the brain.

  72. Walt
    April 22, 2011 at 6:36 am

    Geez, if they legalized it, all the folks growing it, supplying growers, advertising growers’ supplies, giving growers legal representation, teaching growing classes, prescribing it, renting to growers, busting growers, writing stories and blogs about it, they’d ALL be out of work! The unemployment rate would be 50%! Maybe they should make possession a capital offense. . .and create still MORE jobs.

  73. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 6:49 am

    And the hiring rate for prison guards would plummet.

    That’s California’s most important economic indicator.

    Confidence would collapse.

  74. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 7:33 am

    PonderZ should get a life that doesn’t require messing with peoples’ heads for entertainment. Bragging about his sadism is pathetic. What sort of job do you think he has?

  75. Big Al
    April 22, 2011 at 7:54 am

    Ponder, do you have any links to those studies? (or did you forget where you saw them)

  76. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 7:59 am

    Somebody should explain to Ponder what effect THC had on lifelong toker Carl Sagan, the quantum physicist.

  77. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Here is a compilation of MJ research, all sourced, including the Costa Rica study which does not support PonderZ claims.

    http://www.ukcia.org/research/safe-medicine.php

  78. Big Al
    April 22, 2011 at 8:07 am

    ponder musta been tokin’

  79. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:08 am

    THE COSTA RICA STUDY – A Study in Chronic Marijuana Use (1980)

    In 1971, the National Institutes of Health and the University of Florida cooperated in a study led by William Carter to examine chronic cannabis use in Costa Rica. Eighty-four cannabis smokers and 156 control subjects (who had never smoked ganja) were given a battery of sophisticated medical and psychological tests. The similarities between the users and non-users outweighed the differences and the cannabis smokers generally enjoyed longer-lasting relationships with their mates. The study found no significant health consequences to the chronic smokers.

  80. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Not quite that simple:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8911228

    RESULTS: Older long-term users performed worse than older nonusers on 2 short-term memory tests involving learning lists of words. In addition, older long-term users performed worse than older nonusers on selective and divided attention tasks associated with working memory. No notable differences were apparent between younger users and nonusers.

    CONCLUSION:
    Long-term cannabis use was associated with disruption of short-term memory, working memory, and attentional skills in older long-term cannabis users.

  81. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:23 am

    As to PonderZ claims about tests on rats, the actual tests were on monkeys and rats:

    The original basis of this claim was a report that, upon postmortem examinations, structural changes in several brain regions were found in two rhesus monkeys exposed to THC. 51 Because these changes primarily involved the hippocampus, a cortical brain region known to play an important role in learning and memory, this finding suggested possible negative consequences for human marijuana users.

    Additional studies, employing rodents, reported similar brain changes.

    However, to achieve these results, massive doses of THC—up to 200 times the psychoactive dose in humans—had to be given . In fact, studies employing 100 times the human dose have failed to reveal any damage. 52

    In the most recently published study, rhesus monkeys were exposed through face-mask inhalation to the smoke equivalent of four to five joints per day for one year. When sacrificed seven months later, there was no observed alteration of hippocampal architecture, cell size, cell number, or synaptic configuration. The authors conclude:

    “While behavioral and neuroendocrinal effects are observed during marijuana smoke exposure in the monkey, residual neuropathological and neurochemical effects of marijuana exposure were not observed seven months after the year-long marijuana smoke regimen.” 53

  82. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Not that simple either, Mitch. 8 year users showed no difference in cognitive abilities while 34 year users did. Why didn’t you include that sentence in your quote?

  83. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Show me someone who smokes pot regularly, and I’ll show you someone who has more potential than what appears. I think this fun drug is sadly a killer of aspirations and dreams.

  84. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:30 am

    Now who wants to compare this with the studies of the effect of chronic alcohol use on cognitive abilities?

  85. High Finance
    April 22, 2011 at 8:32 am

    The truth hurts and Ponder, you have hurt a lot of people here today.

  86. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:34 am

    I included the results and conclusions from the online abstract, Plain Jane, including this sentence:

    “No notable differences were apparent between younger users and nonusers.”

    I’m not trying to cherry-pick facts.

  87. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 8:37 am

    That’s a given, Jane. I agree. I wish the holy ganja didn’t get so much love from the youth. Smoke it for fun but a daily dose is like any addiction.

  88. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:38 am

    Poor HiFi is still in agony over his exposure to the truth of his right wing authoritarian follower mindset. Wanna bet he still hasn’t even read the essay, much less the book, he has been encouraged to read and provided the link?

  89. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:39 am

    I see Mitch. You posted from the abstract and not the actual report.

  90. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:39 am

    I’d be very surprised if there were a drug which affected mental state and did not have long-term effects.

    There’s no need to deny that in order to support pot decriminalization.

    I think anyone who wants to smoke pot should be free to do so, and anyone who wants to go into business growing, say, an acre or two and selling the results should be free to do so.

    I don’t think it will be beneficial to have Phillip Morris marketing pot to kids (that is, to 21 year olds… Phillip Morris would never market to kids).

  91. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:41 am

    Bad day, Jane? I posted the link to the abstract and quoted the results and conclusions from that link, in their entirety.

  92. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:44 am

    “Up to 80 percent of alcoholics, however, have a deficiency in thiamine (15), and some of these people will go on to develop serious brain disorders such as Wernicke–Korsakoff syndrome (WKS) (16). WKS is a disease that consists of two separate syndromes, a short–lived and severe condition called Wernicke’s encephalopathy and a long–lasting and debilitating condition known as Korsakoff’s psychosis.

    The symptoms of Wernicke’s encephalopathy include mental confusion, paralysis of the nerves that move the eyes (i.e., oculomotor disturbances), and difficulty with muscle coordination. For example, patients with Wernicke’s encephalopathy may be too confused to find their way out of a room or may not even be able to walk. Many Wernicke’s encephalopathy patients, however, do not exhibit all three of these signs and symptoms, and clinicians working with alcoholics must be aware that this disorder may be present even if the patient shows only one or two of them. In fact, studies performed after death indicate that many cases of thiamine deficiency–related encephalopathy may not be diagnosed in life because not all the “classic” signs and symptoms were present or recognized.

    Approximately 80 to 90 percent of alcoholics with Wernicke’s encephalopathy also develop Korsakoff’s psychosis, a chronic and debilitating syndrome characterized by persistent learning and memory problems. Patients with Korsakoff’s psychosis are forgetful and quickly frustrated and have difficulty with walking and coordination (17). Although these patients have problems remembering old information (i.e., retrograde amnesia), it is their difficulty in “laying down” new information (i.e., anterograde amnesia) that is the most striking. For example, these patients can discuss in detail an event in their lives, but an hour later might not remember ever having the conversation.”

    http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/aa63/aa63.htm

  93. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:45 am

    No, Mitch. I didn’t click your link because I assumed it was the one I had already read and posted to the whole study.

  94. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:49 am

    Can’t find your link, PJ. The abstract I linked was from a 1996 study, though.

  95. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Jeezus, I guess I am having a bad day. I attempted to post the link but didn’t. I’ll have to find it again.

  96. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 8:57 am

    I’d also encourage any hypothetical soul who wanted to limit themselves to one drug and who was now enjoying alcohol to switch immediately to pot.

    Aside from the legal risks, it’s far less hazardous. That’s as clear as any fact can be.

    Don’t think continuous pot use over years won’t screw up your memory. But maybe if you can stay with your mate longer, he or she can help you remember where you put your keys.

  97. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 9:14 am

    As I’m looking for the actual report, I came across repeated claims that:
    “The NIH refused to accept the final report for publication and demanded that it be rewritten three times. Still not satisfied, they had it rewritten again by another editor and ultimately printed only 300 copies.”

  98. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 9:38 am

    For anyone who is truly interested in an honest comparison of drug risks, here are two links. The first is to a Time magazine article about a British study; the second is to the British study at The Lancet, a prestigious academic journal. Unfortunately, all you get for free from The Lancet is a summary of the article.

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=6&ved=0CD8QFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fhealthland.time.com%2F2010%2F11%2F01%2Fthe-most-dangerous-drugs-alcohol-heroin-and-crack%25E2%2580%2594in-that-order%2F&ei=j62xTZb2EIvTiALS_eyvBg&usg=AFQjCNGSNO48GDvDI_fXFX4Nc4TclzcVUQ&sig2=WqhpHk6c3XwaIleJtnAuyQ

    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(11)60199-2/fulltext

  99. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:05 am

    I’ve been searching for the original Costa Rica Study, rather than government or pot advocate’s interpretations of it and the best I could find was a review of Carter’s book, “Cannabis in Costa Rica: A Study of Marijuana Use” in American Ethnologist, Vol. 9, Issue 3

    “In view of the ambitious investment of time, effort, and money that was aimed at providing
    complementary biological and medical data, with unusually close collaboration on the part of practitioners from various disciplines, it is striking (Quoting from the report here) “no significant univariate or multivariate differences were found on the 16 variables derived from the neuropsychological test battery”
    (p. 204)

    This point is underscored: “Many of us were frankly surprised that we were unable to uncover any real consequences of prolonged use of the drug. Indeed, some of the physicians and psychologists on our team were sincerely disappointed at the lack of significant differences between our controlled population of users and nonusers” (p. 206)”

    Hopefully you can access it here:

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1525/ae.1982.9.3.02a00300/pdf

  100. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:06 am

    Would that explain why NIH wouldn’t accept his report as written?

  101. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 10:12 am

    I think pot is far less hazardous to your body. I think it is far more hazardous to your finances, as there is a problem with work ethic and achievement. Moderation always seems key.

  102. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 10:16 am

    My earlier link to The Lancet missed the article.

    Here’s a Guardian article about the study, in case you don’t like the Time report:
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/nov/01/alcohol-more-harmful-than-heroin-crack

    Personally, PJ, I don’t believe that most scientific publications will decline articles just because they don’t like the conclusions. But peer review might be more intense, I suppose.

  103. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:17 am

    This section of the review was extremely interesting:

    Although marijuana use is illegal in Costa Rica and it has become a focus of considerable police action as well as “journalistic “viewing with alarm” in recent years, veteran users consider it socially harmless and healthful rather than harmful in a physical sense. Data from life histories demonstrate forcefully that “rather than being a cause of marginality and stress, marihuana use is the result” (p. 195) It is not used as an escape from their ordinary lives but is an integral part of it . Contrary to what some might expect of “deviant behavior,” the University of Florida researchers f o u n d that “the heavier the use, the more stable the employment record was, the fewer the periods of unemployment were (pg 195) and heavier users “also owned significantly more material goods” (p. 199). As was reported in earlier work b y Rubin, Comitas, and others in Jamaica, the drug is viewed as an energizer by veteran users who report work as their preferred activity while smoking, and they joke about the recreational “high” that Costa Rican students boast of achieving with relatively little marijuana.”

  104. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:19 am

    That may be true of privately owned publications, Mitch. However, NIH is owned by the federal government.

  105. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 10:22 am

    Maybe I’m too trusting, PJ (!), but I think science publications use peer review, not politics, whether hosted at the NIH or privately. Advisory reports might be another matter.

    I don’t doubt that funding decisions are political, but I’d be disappointed to discover that publication decisions were.

  106. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:27 am

    The review concludes, “In short, this is a solid piece of reporting about a significant multidisciplinary study on a subject that could easily have been sensationalized. It offers no comfort to those who would ban the drug as physically, mentally, morally or otherwise deleterious. Neither does it offer pot fans or voyeurs any titillation or insights into the subjective aspects of long-term heavy users. In fact, it appears as if there may well have been some
    deliberate down-playing of the findings; such a
    reaction would be quite understandable in view
    of press reaction to more fragmentary research
    on marijuana use. For those who are seriously interested in the uses of drugs, in sociocultural con-
    text and in cross-cultural comparisons, this is an
    important contribution.”

    The review was by Dwight B. Heath at Brown University

  107. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:33 am

    Well Mitch, direct quotes from the report Carter wrote and what is available from the NIH appear to be somewhat contradictory in their conclusions. I suppose if we had the actual scores from the tests which demonstrated a loss of cognitive abilities in older longterm smokers compared to older never used, we might see if they were significant or not. While the review doesn’t give the scores either, Carter’s interpretation (direct quotes) of them was that there were no significant differences.

  108. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:36 am

    Too bad we can’t compare the cognitive abilities of older longterm smokers with older never smoked on blogs. (I crack myself up sometimes)

  109. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 10:38 am

    I managed to put my life back together after smoking pot, losing my ability to study effectively, losing my formerly steel-trap memory, suffering the effects of the PCP some axxhole who pretended to be my friend put in a bowl and insisted I smoke with him, being forced by circumstances to drop out of school and losing almost all hope. The human mind is complex. No simple prescription for happiness can be right for every person in every circumstance.

    The choice of using either pot OR alcohol as presented here is an exercise in rhetoric, not an attempt to help real people solve real problems in their lives.

  110. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 10:41 am

    Was it the PCP or the pot that caused your problems, 10:38?

  111. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 10:57 am

    The pot damaged my short-term memory to the point that dropping out of classes became one of my major strategies for preserving my grade point average, Jane. Eventually, I dropped out of college altogether.

    The PCP incident happened later, leading to even more serious problems.

  112. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 11:02 am

    Sorry to hear that, 10:57. Did you have short term memory loss even when you weren’t high or were you high all the time?

  113. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:05 am

    I wish I had known back in my 20s about ADHD (ADD).

    Dr Hallowell and Dr Ratey wrote Driven to Distraction about twenty years ago. In it, they informed the world that ADD does not disappear when a child reaches the age of 18. It continues into adulthood. This was a revelation at the time!

    Each of these M.D.s have adult ADHD themselves.

    They followed up with their book Answers to Distraction. It that book, they name marijuana as the single “most dangerous substance of addiction for the ADD adolescent.”

    Later, in 2009, Dr. Hallowell was asked if he and Dr Ratey stood by their position on marijuana. His answer can be found at the link below.

    http://www.drhallowell.com/blog/on-marijuana-and-adhd/

  114. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:11 am

    Jane, I was very conservative in my use of marijuana. I was smoking that very weak Mexican pot that was available in Arcata during the late 1960’s. I only smoked, as I remember it, on weekends, when I thought it wouldn’t interfere with my studies. I was definitely not high all the time. In fact, using that pot, my problems were not too bad.

    As I remember now, my worst problems with local pot came when a friend offered me some high-test Mendocino weed. I took two hits and was so stoned – and stunned – I could not walk or talk for four hours.

    After that, things began to go downhill rapidly.

    I ought to write a book.

  115. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 11:19 am

    Sounds like you are allergic or something, 11:11. I’ve never seen anyone get that stoned no matter how much they smoked.

  116. Mark Sailors
    April 22, 2011 at 11:23 am

    So, back to the topic…….trashing the park…….

  117. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:24 am

    OMG Jane, are you kidding? Have to disagree. get some strong stuff and it can throw you for a loop. My friends called 911 when they thought they were going to hyperventilate to death after eating some brownies, and so did some cop recently. he thought it was dying. Any drug can have an awful effect on a person, depending on that’s person’s health and depending on the strength and type of the drug. I won’t stand up for pot. Are you? I think it’s just for now and then, not often!

  118. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 11:24 am

    I can’t think of any ingestible (or topical) substance that at least some people don’t have problems with including, but not limited to: milk, sugar, coffee, wheat, corn, peanuts, cheese, etc. Underlying conditions can’t be blamed on the substance.

  119. Loser
    April 22, 2011 at 11:25 am

    I want to blame my wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and gluttony on pot. I am not responsible for my behavior, its the pot, I’m blaming the pot.

  120. Mark Seamen
    April 22, 2011 at 11:26 am

    So, back to the subject … no more freedom for people who think differently than me.

  121. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 11:27 am

    It is possible to overdose on anything. You can die from drinking too much water, FFS.

  122. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:29 am

    Jane, I am the Anonymous 11:11. Not the Anon who started by saying OMG.

    It’s not allergy.

    I’ll try to type the answer given in the book Answers to Distraction. No time right now. I think their answers might help you understand.

  123. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 11:34 am

    So people with ADHD shouldn’t use pot and people who are allergic to peanuts shouldn’t eat them. That doesn’t equate to either pot or peanuts being bad for everyone.

  124. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:39 am

    I think pot is bad for people who have dreams and want a clear mind to see them to fruition. I think alcohol is bad too, and will get in the way of those dreams, but in a different way. I think initially alcohol will not effect those dreams, but pot will stunt them from the start.

  125. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 11:51 am

    I’ve heard lots of stories of people becoming unmotivated and dropping out of college “because they took pot.”

    But I’ve also heard and can vouch for lots of people becoming unmotivated and dropping out of college without taking pot.

    I’m one, though I resumed after a semester.

    Well, to be completely accurate, I lived next door to a total stoner, and I had a baby puff from his pipe once, after carefully checking up and down the dorm hallways. I doubt that caused me to drop out. I don’t think I noticed ANY effect, probably because I *really* didn’t inhale. And the stoner graduated a semester ahead of me.

    BTW, anon, I’m not disagreeing with you; I’m just agreeing with what you said — different people will react differently. That’s no reason to outlaw the users of one drug, putting its distributors behind bars, while celebrating the users of another and giving executive bonuses to its pushers.

  126. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 11:51 am

    Jane, The Anon above is not 11:11. I am. The next post from me will be two paragraphs from Answers to Distraction. It may be a while before I post them. I have an appointment on the other side of town in 15 minutes. Be back soon.

  127. Not A Native
    April 22, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    Well, PJ 10:36, commenters here offer their personal anecdotal reports about the longterm effects of chronic pot use. Those stories may not constitute data, but they’re significant to the actual lives of the people who relate them.

    Science finds that heroin and cocaine per se have mild negative longterm physical effects. But those drugs are villified vis a vis pot simply because of historical circumstance.

    Its my experience that by the 60’s, integration had put post WWII prosperity educated middle class White youth into social contact with Latinos and Blacks. Pot use was already popular in activist Latino and Black cultures because it was traditional, inexpensive, and readily available. As a result of the social contacts(and the Vietnam war), middle class White youth agitated for social reforms.

    Social reform at the time meant realizing a ‘melting together merging of cultures’. Adopting pot was one element of that merging and became a symbol for social reform. The fact that it had intoxicating effects was why it became a long lasting symbol, while afros, dashikis, serape wearing faded away. It’s simply an accident of history and economics that pot became popularly differentiated as more acceptable than other and less harmful drugs.

    I find it silly how people here can be so adamantly against less harmful euphoria and stimulant drugs that they villify as ‘hard’ while they fixate on the virtues of their chosen symbolic cultural drug, whether it be pot, beer, tequila, wine, scotch, or coffee. I wonder if the next generation will have similar attitudes but for Ecstasy or whatever.

  128. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    NaN,

    Heroin and meth are PROPERLY vilified because they are physically addictive. Cocaine is, at the least, psychologically addictive.

  129. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 12:14 pm

    It isn’t hard to make the case that drugs with strong addictive properties like opiates from which people suffer agonizing withdrawal are more harmful than pot, Nan. Moderation in all things is good advice. The occasional heroin “chippie” may suffer no ill effects, but they can become physically addicted and are in danger of overdose when their dose is too pure. A large share of the harm from any illicit drug is due to its illegality, of course.

  130. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    Hey, 11:51. I am the other anon and I completely agree with you, and have followed Hallowell as well, since I have multiple family members with AD/HD and/or ADD and have taken part in a study with the NIH to discover genomes linking us. Study is not complete, to my knowledge. I just wanted to tell you I agree about the pot thing. It doesn’t work with ADHD, a bad mix. Won’t be able to answer as I will be driving.

  131. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    Thank you, “the other anon.” It’s always encouraging to hear from another person who knows the score from a personal perspective.

    Now, Plain Jane, I am sitting down to write those paragraphs from Answers to Distraction I promised. Check back in about 15 minutes. I will post them separately from this note.

  132. Plain Jane
    April 22, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    Is anyone arguing that people with ADHD, or anyone else, should smoke pot? Information about why people with ADHD shouldn’t smoke pot should be widely disseminated if it is harmful to them. But that’s not the majority of people.

  133. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    The following Q&A is directly from Chapter 15 of Dr. Edward M. Hallowell and Dr. John J. Ratey’s book Answers to Distraction, published in 1994 by Pantheon Books. I copied it from the first edition.

    Q: In your experience, what is the most dangerous substance of addiction for the ADD adolescent?

    A: Without a doubt, it is marijuana. Rachel Gittleman-Klein, a pioneer in studying ADD’s course through the life cycle, warns against an ADD child using marijuana even once. Its effects are so compelling for the ADD brain that it seems to become immediately psychologically addictive. It creates a calmness with a heightened sense of adventure – all within the brain. One of the true delights for ADD people is to play with their thoughts and their ideas and build intense and intricate fantasies. Marijuana accentuates the zaniness and doubles the intensity, all within the backdrop of serenity.

    We see so many adults in their late twenties who have been addicted to heavy daily doses of marijuana for years, and have seen their great potential wasted in acrid smoke. The irony is that marijuana makes ADD symptoms worse. It makes you more distractible, worsens your memory, increases the tendency to procrastinate, and decreases motivation. It should be avoided at all costs, for it lurks as a temptation that can destroy a life.

  134. Anonymous
    April 22, 2011 at 1:54 pm

    Mitch, I am “He who advises ADHD youth to avoid smoking pot.” If you look back at my posts, I think you will notice I did not say marijuana should be banned by law.

    In fact, my ideas about how Law and Individual Freedom should play upon one another are in a state of change.

    It seems more and more to me that Law is making a mockery of America’s traditional ideas of Freedom.

    However, I believe in encouraging young people to consider carefully how the use of certain substances might either make their known problems worse or cause them to develop new problems that might dog them for a long time.

    Clearly, the Law is not powerful enough to force a change in behavior. Maybe we can all accept that people will learn by observing what happens around them and to them. Maybe we don’t need a big Policeman to save us from our big Fears. Maybe we can quell the Fear inside our own souls and so stop demanding protection from the Devil we think resides outside us.

    Like Marijuana, for example.

    It’s a substance, not the Devil.

    I state the obvious.

  135. Mitch
    April 22, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    Absolutely, 1:54. Lots of stuff that’s legal is stupid.

  136. Thr truth
    April 22, 2011 at 6:01 pm

    Hi ALL!!! I just wanted to stop by and see what B.S. you all are clambering to gobble down today. Once again, all you far out lefties with your skewed views and ill-informed opnions are blairing away on your soap boxes as if someone actually cares what a bunch of perma-fried, non-contributing, free-loading sheep think. Just remember, the writer is trying to get something, weather it’s money from this, or from a book he or they intend to write. THERE IS SOMETHING TO BE GAINED! Just look closely folks, squint real hard. Rdmember, most everything you read here is nothing but slander and lies! Enjoy your daily helping of horse pucky.

  137. Ed
    April 22, 2011 at 6:15 pm

    Someone’s been starting to imbibe early tonight, eh “Truth”?

  138. beel
    April 22, 2011 at 6:15 pm

    to Anonymous 11:28pm
    the Redwood Forest is blooming like crazy right now. dozens of native plants are in flower.
    go for a walk and check it out.

  139. Big Al
    April 22, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    the “e” key is the one just to the left of the “r” key

    you did mean thE truth right??

  140. Mark Sailors
    April 23, 2011 at 8:52 am

    “Thr truth says:
    April 22, 2011 at 6:01 pm

    Hi ALL!!! I just wanted to stop by and see what B.S. you all are clambering to gobble down today. Once again, all you far out lefties with your skewed views and ill-informed opnions are blairing away on your soap boxes as if someone actually cares what a bunch of perma-fried, non-contributing, free-loading sheep think. Just remember, the writer is trying to get something, weather it’s money from this, or from a book he or they intend to write. THERE IS SOMETHING TO BE GAINED! Just look closely folks, squint real hard. Rdmember, most everything you read here is nothing but slander and lies! Enjoy your daily helping of horse pucky.”

    First, learn to spell.
    Second, liberals ( lefties) can understand complex thoughts and ideas, conservatives base their world view on fear.

    It is not our fault that your brain can not contemplate complex issues, and makes all of its decisions based on what you are afraid of.

  141. Mark Sailors
    April 23, 2011 at 9:01 am

    “Anonymous says:
    April 22, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    The following Q&A is directly from Chapter 15 of Dr. Edward M. Hallowell and Dr. John J. Ratey’s book Answers to Distraction, published in 1994 by Pantheon Books. I copied it from the first edition.

    Q: In your experience, what is the most dangerous substance of addiction for the ADD adolescent?

    A: Without a doubt, it is marijuana. Rachel Gittleman-Klein, a pioneer in studying ADD’s course through the life cycle, warns against an ADD child using marijuana even once. Its effects are so compelling for the ADD brain that it seems to become immediately psychologically addictive. It creates a calmness with a heightened sense of adventure – all within the brain. One of the true delights for ADD people is to play with their thoughts and their ideas and build intense and intricate fantasies. Marijuana accentuates the zaniness and doubles the intensity, all within the backdrop of serenity.

    We see so many adults in their late twenties who have been addicted to heavy daily doses of marijuana for years, and have seen their great potential wasted in acrid smoke. The irony is that marijuana makes ADD symptoms worse. It makes you more distractible, worsens your memory, increases the tendency to procrastinate, and decreases motivation. It should be avoided at all costs, for it lurks as a temptation that can destroy a life.”

    Lies based on fear. They had no clinical studies.

    Try reading some FACTS:

    http://www.cannabis-med.org/english/journal/en_2008_01_1.pdf

    http://www.showmethefacts.org/medical-marijuana-facts/add-adhd/

  142. Mark Sailors
  143. Anonymous
    April 23, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Not all facts are based on clinical studies. Some facts are discovered through life experience.

  144. Mr. Nice
    April 28, 2011 at 6:39 pm

    Not all facts are based on clinical studies. Some facts are discovered through life experience.

    Conjecture based on experiences is better than empirical evidence.

  145. April 28, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    “Mr. Nice says:
    April 28, 2011 at 6:39 pm

    Not all facts are based on clinical studies. Some facts are discovered through life experience.

    Conjecture based on experiences is better than empirical evidence.”

    So says the Spanish Inquisition…..!?

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