Home > crime, Humboldt County > McKinleyville, Garberbille Sheriff substations on the chopping block

McKinleyville, Garberbille Sheriff substations on the chopping block

The Humboldt Deputy Sheriffs Organization has released a multi-media blitz over budget cuts that could close substations and increase response time to emergency calls. They are asking residents to sign a petition to urge the Board of Supervisors to preserve funding for the substations.

Press Release, charts and radio ad below.

(Click chart to enlarge or download the pdf.)


Staff budget proposal would force closure of McKinleyville and Garberville Sheriff Substations

EUREKA – Members of the Humboldt Deputy Sheriffs Organization (HDSO) released a radio advertisement voicing concerns about Humboldt County budget staff’s proposal that would force the closure the McKinleyville and Garberville Sheriff Department Substations and cut 20 law enforcement officers. The cuts would leave only 73 deputies, sergeants, and investigators to cover Humboldt County’s 4,000 rugged square miles from the downtown Eureka headquarters.

“The budget cuts before the Board of Supervisors would reduce Humboldt County law enforcement patrols back to something resembling the Wild West,” said HDSO president Detective Steve Quenell. “We understand the county is facing tough economic times, but the Board of Supervisors has the same responsibility to protect the public as our sworn deputies. They must exhaust every possible option before cutting public safety coverage back to unprecedented levels.”

HDSO, the organization representing the rank and file law enforcement officers in Humboldt County, is particularly concerned about the proposed closure of sheriff ‘s department substations in both Northern and Southern Humboldt County.

“McKinleyville is much too large of a community with too many families and homes to not have a full-time law enforcement presence,” said Detective Quenell. He added, “Without the Garberville substation, families and businesses all over Southern Humboldt would almost be guaranteed an hour wait for law enforcement to respond to a call from their Eureka sheriff’s department headquarters – that is just not safe.”

HDSO represents the rank and file law enforcement personnel of Humboldt County. Their members have 25 different law enforcement responsibilities and cover one of the largest and most rugged geographical areas of the state, with populated areas spread throughout the region. The geography and demographics of the county already dictate thin law enforcement coverage in outlying areas, but the proposed budget cuts would exacerbate that problem.

Quenell noted, “With the Blue Lake and Trinidad Police Departments being recently disbanded, we have even more area to cover than ever before. And, now they want to cut 20 law enforcement officers, leaving us with only 73? There has to be a better way to solve the County’s budget without so dramatically threatening the public’s safety and the safety of the deputies left to patrol the community.”

Radio ad.

  1. May 26, 2011 at 9:02 am

    The murders just two months ago in Kettenpom with the subsequent injuries of the neighbors, Jim and Norma Gund, show what can happen if there are too little officers for too much area. Definitely the Gund’s would have been spared their ordeal and possibly even Kristin and Sky would still be alive if Kristin’s 911 call could have received immediate attention.

  2. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:10 am

    From the context of the story, I take it that the blue line is population, whereas the red line is the # of law enforcement officers. But for clarity, you might want to provide that info on the graph.

  3. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:14 am

    By the way, I’m wondering whether the # of law enforcement officers referred to on this chart includes municipal police forces, such as Eureka, Arcata, and Fortuna. Since the chart refers to the overall population of Humboldt County, it seems like it ought to include the overall number of law enforcement officers, not just those working for the county Sheriff.

    By the way, what’s the story on the the huge reduction around 1980?

  4. May 26, 2011 at 9:15 am

    Readers will have to either rely on their smarts or click the pdf for full chart details.

  5. May 26, 2011 at 9:17 am

    I’m wondering whether the # of law enforcement officers referred to on this chart includes municipal police forces

    The red line is the number of deputies, sergeants and investigators, not municipal officers.

  6. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:30 am

    The red line is the number of deputies, sergeants and investigators, not municipal officers.

    If the blue line is the total population of Humboldt County (both municipal and county), then the chart is not a great comparison.

    I’d like to see what the chart looks like when the municipal officers are added in, or else when the population figures are adjusted to refer only to the non-municipal population — in other words just the folks that the sheriffs are actually responsible for policing.

    By the way, I don’t doubt that there’s a problem, I would just like to see a more accurate portrayl of the actual dimensions of the problem.

    I certainly agree that closing the Garberville and McKinleyville substations and increasing the response times in those communities could have very harmful effects on residents in NoHum and SoHum.

  7. juxtaposition
    May 26, 2011 at 9:34 am

    On the one hand, CalTrans has unlimited budget to spend on unnecessary projects.

    On the other hand, our law enforcement has insufficient budget for staffing at levels we need.

    How about we take our money away from CalTrans and use more rationally? Has CalTrans’ budget been cut? I hear they are spending millions to remodel their offices.

  8. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:34 am

    And I’m definitely intrigued about what happened back around 1980. What led to the dramatic cut in the number of sheriff’s deputies? And was there any appreciable increase in serious crimes as a result of that dramatic cutback?

  9. Anonymous
    May 26, 2011 at 9:35 am

    HCSO has money for an ad?

  10. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:37 am


    Now I see the labels for the red and blue lines. Were they there all along and I just somehow managed to miss them…or did you add them?

  11. May 26, 2011 at 9:47 am

    I added them following your question about whether the red line represented all police or just sheriffs. But readers should download the pdf if they want more information.

  12. Anonymous
    May 26, 2011 at 9:51 am

    Police, fire protection, roads and schools cost more and are harder to provide the more spread out the population. Services for rural communities will always be the first to get cut, less voters there.

  13. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 9:58 am

    Of course McKinleyville isn’t particularly rural or “spread out,” and there are a lot of voters there.

  14. May 26, 2011 at 10:10 am

    “Kym Kemp says:
    May 26, 2011 at 9:02 am

    The murders just two months ago in Kettenpom with the subsequent injuries of the neighbors, Jim and Norma Gund, show what can happen if there are too little officers for too much area. Definitely the Gund’s would have been spared their ordeal and possibly even Kristin and Sky would still be alive if Kristin’s 911 call could have received immediate attention.”

    I would say that the murders were a direct result of gun laws that are too strict and a population that fears owning and using weapons for self defense.
    When guns are hard to own legally only criminals will own guns.

  15. ChumBolly
    May 26, 2011 at 10:38 am

    HCSO has money for an ad?

    No, the Union does.

  16. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 10:53 am


    The Kettlepom murderer used a knife, not a gun, so it wasn’t an example of gun laws being too strict to the point where “only criminals will own guns.”

    Now if the victims had a gun and the attacker only had a knife, then I suppose the attack might have been thwarted (or detered in the first place). But if both the attacker and the victims had been armed with guns, but the attacker had still taken them by surprise (which seems to be what actually happened in that case), then it’s hard to see how the outcome would have been any better.

    And when the neighbors responded to the scene, again the issue was that the attacker took them by surprise, not that the attacker was armed with a gun while the neighbors were not. Again, had both the attacker and the neighbors been armed with guns, but the attacker had still taken the neighbors by surprise, then it’s hard to see how the outcome would have been any better — in fact it might have been worse.

    While I agree with you on the general point that, especially in rural areas, people should be prepared to defend themselves, that particular case does not really make a very good example of the “…then only criminals will have guns” argument.

  17. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 11:26 am

    Okay, I’m gonna have to officially call “bullshit” on this apples-to-oranges comparison from the HDSO.

    According to the county’s web page, the unincorporated parts of the county only account for about half of the population. And the population living in the unincorporated portions of the county barely grew at all between 1998 and 2010, while the population in the municipalities (most of which have their own police officers, which are “conveniently” not represented in the HDSO’s graph) grew substantially:

    1998 2010
    Eureka 27,750 28,870
    Arcata 16,330 18,180
    Fortuna 10,140 12,560
    Unincorporated areas 67,400 67,800
    County TOTAL 124,000 131,600


    It looks to me like the HDSO has deliberately fudged the numbers to make it look as if the proportion of sheriff’s deputies to people who they are responsible for serving has declined dramatically. Maybe it has, but the graph that was included with the HDSO press release, with its apples-to-oranges comparison of ALL residents to only SOME law enforcement, is not evidence of that.

    Hopefully one of our local journalists or bloggers will provide us with a more accurate comparison so that the appropriate conculsions can be drawn.

    I’m still open to the argument that the sheriff’s dept. is being asked to shoulder an unfair portion of the budget cuts, but this attempt to serve up misleading data to the public lowers the credibility of the HDSO as it tries to make its case.

  18. Teacher
    May 26, 2011 at 11:40 am

    Nice research tra. That does make that graph look like a bunch of crap.

  19. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Note that according to the county’s website, the population of the unincorporated areas (those people the county sheriff’s dept. is actually responsible for policing) only grew by about 400 people in between 1998 and 2010, whereas the population of the three largest municipalites grew by several thousand. Yet the HDSO’s graph misleadingly makes it look as if all the new municipal residents were part of the population served by the County sheriffs. Which makes it look like the sheriff’s department is stretched a lot thinner than it really is.

    Assuming the figures on the county’s website are correct, then those who cooked up that HDSO graph ought to be ashamed of themselves for attempting to mislead the public (I hope they are more honest when they write up police reports for the court system!) And any self-respecting journalist (or blogger) ought to point out the blatantly misleading nature of the statistics offered by HDSO.

  20. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    In fairness, I should note that the sheriff’s deputies may be called upon to provide service to municipal residents, when crimes occuring against thoe residents took place in the unincorporated parts of the county. But of course the reverse is true as well — residents of the unincorporated areas may be served by municipal police officers when crimes against them take place within city limits.

  21. skippy
    May 26, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    Sources inside the recent confidential HDSO union negotiations say Sheriff officers are unwilling to make benefit and wage concessions for newly hired employees and have reached an impasse. Probation Department officers within the same union, however, are willing to make these reductions– splitting the two agencies from reaching a concurrent agreement helping to balance the budget.

    At the Board of Supervisors meeting, Sheriff Downey expressed cooperation of working with the Board concerning staff and fiscal cutbacks with a limited budget while equally supporting his staff. Chief Probation Officer Damiano lamented the impending layoffs of 3-7 new officers providing supervision for offenders.

    Neither these departments, the Board, the CAO, or the HDSO union, though, wish to revisit the now-prudent issue of returning back to a 37.5 hour county employee work week– or other similar ‘austerity’ measures. Enacted in 1992 during a similar budget crisis, the reduction of hours to a 37.5 work week– as opposed to the traditional 40 hour week– saved staff positions, safety officers, and the substations in the same argument we’re hearing today.

    The CAO at the time also asked county employees and the public for suggestions to reduce costs, redundancy, and bloated operations. Hundreds of comments poured in; many were reasonably imposed. Since this time, the County and State budget had improved, the 37.5 hour week fell by the wayside, and County departments and operations increased. Mandated services, dependent grant funding, administrative positions, salaries, and benefits also grew, leaving us into the current fiscal predicament. We are now faced with the stranglehold of choosing between public safety, layoffs, or… (gasp!)– new taxes.

    The County’s recent Community Budget workshops flirted with the idea by suggesting new tax measures and gauging current public sentiment, noting Eureka’s successful passage of Measure O. Supervisor Sundberg recently inquired into using Headwaters monies for the Sheriff substations– before being dissuaded by CAO Smith-Hanes on the limitations and charter disallowing its use for ‘fiscal emergencies.’ To note, this was the second attempt by the Board to crack open the Headwaters funds for County operations; another previous attempt only weeks earlier resulted in a Grand Jury letter of inquiry.

    The HDSO is now ramping up media efforts to have you choose and lobby for them while unwilling to make concessions for future hires and averting the issue.

    Have all the options really been put on the table for you to look at carefully?

  22. SpinMaster
    May 26, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    They could still make this graph work and account for the relatively small, 400 person, increase in unincorporated population:
    Stretch the vertical axis to increments of 400 people. Then, there would still be a big gap between blue and red even though it is for a small population. It’s always possible to make an impressive graph even if the data are less than compelling.

  23. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:21 pm

    Thanks for that, Skippy. Very interesting.

  24. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:21 pm


    Don’t go giving them any ideas!

  25. Anonymous
    May 26, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    It rarely works for a public employee union to take their fight to the media. Their salaries and benefits become part of the discussion, and even if the wages are justified they lose public sympathy.

  26. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    They actually had more sympathy from me before they tried to fool me with blatantly misleading statistics. The fact that they would do something like that suggests that they must have a much weaker case than I had thought.

  27. Teacher
    May 26, 2011 at 12:39 pm

    The state and county budgets are woeful and everybody is hurting. The police are going to have to take it on the chin like the rest of us. Look at the education profession and the colleges! All the public sector unions, teachers included, need to look at the financial situation the state is in and make concessions. It won’t happen of course, but it would be the sensible thing to do.

  28. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    Also odd is the long space between the last two data points — all the way from 1991 to 2011. It would be interesting to see what the trend line for the number of sheriff’s deputies looked like if more data points were included in between 1991 and 2011.

    For example, if the polulation figures were limited to the non-municipal population of the county, and if a few more data points were included for the past decade, would this show that until the recent (proposed) cuts, the number of county sheriff’s deputies had actually increased faster than the portion of the county population that the sheriff’s dept. is actually responsible for policing (those not living in municipalities that have their own police forces)?

    Just a couple of years ago, the sheriff’s department apparently had enough staff (and/or a skewed sense of priorities?) to the point where they could spare a dozen heavily-armed cops to carry out a military-style raid / fishing expedition at the Yee-Haw Ranch in Trinidad — all supposedly justified by some pretty minor code enforcement stuff (unpermitted greywater systems, people living in cabins and converted schoolbuses, etc.) and there were similar over-staffed “fishing expedition” code raids in SoHum. Judging from those incidents, it seemed at the time that the sheriff’s dept. may have become, well, a bit bloated at that point in time.

    Now the recently proposed cuts may go too far in the other direction, but this chart, with it’s lack of data points between 1991 and the present, may be concealing the fact that the sheriff’s department had been rather (over?)generously funded for a few years there, and that the current cuts may be, in part, a necessary course correction given the county’s current financial straits.

    Again, I’m not at all denying the fact that these current proposed cuts may go too far, but it would be helpful to have a fuller picture of the overall situation.

  29. Nuts and Bolts
    May 26, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    I have not had a chance to review the budget line by line, but I did work on a municipal budget committee in this county several years ago. Two patterns we discovered were; 1) many “would be nice to have” items were still in the budget and many “important to have” items were being deleted. And 2) Management is in charge of layoffs. Hence, the workers go, damagement stays. What these two patterns show is that if the government puts the squeeze on the taxpayers through painful cuts and less workers, then we will cry uncle and go for more taxes. The entire process was rather disheartening. We found management to be deeply entrenched and clearly in charge of the public process/services/budget/spending/etc.

  30. Nuts and Bolts
    May 26, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    Heraldo. I accidentally posted this also on “Richardson Grove” in error.

  31. The Big Picture
    May 26, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    Even as urban taxpayers continue losing jobs, homes and health care in record numbers; our city’s infrastructure rapidly decays, schools close, and crime skyrockets, this areas largest remaining political/financial force is ALL OVER the GPU protecting their financial windfall from fewer regulations and restrictions on EVEN MORE rural homes and sprawling subdivisions developed on cheap, remote lands that few can afford.

    Exchange the words “taxpayer subsidies for infrastructure and services exploited by a wealthy minority”, with, “3rd world minerals and labor exploited by a wealthy minority”, and you’ve just explained this nation’s domestic and foreign policy.

    A mass psychology of imperial fascism guaranteed to expropriate more wealth for fewer and fewer people…no different from the predation of every previous empire that eventually turned on its own people before its inevitable collapse.

  32. McKinleyvillan
    May 26, 2011 at 12:56 pm

    McKinleyville property owners pay a parcel tax for the fire dept. Maybe it’s time we pay one for police as well.

  33. Teacher
    May 26, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    Big Pic, I think you have over-simplified the situation. Are you suggesting that local developers are at fault for our local economy and that the recession we are in is not a direct result of the economic woes of our state and our country?
    McKinleyvillan, I think you are right. It would be interesting to know what kind of a tax people in rural areas would have to pay for increased police services. Seems to me that cutting back services is part of the answer, and the other part is increasing taxes.

  34. skippy
    May 26, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    Tra, nice research, good work, and thought. Yours truly got it. Thank you.

  35. Not A Native
    May 26, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Yep, I also had the suspicion that the chart was likely misleading. Well, misleading charts aren’t a novel idea. I remember seeing President Reagan displaying the bogus Laffer curve charts in a nationally televised speech.

    I believe the HCSO has individual contracts with the cities of Blue Lake and Trinidad to provide police services. Does the chart include the sheriff personnel used for those contracts? I suspect it does.

    Though those cities are paying for services outside of the county budget, I’m sure its impossible to figure out the exact costs. The cost obviously depends on actual numbers of calls/incidents.

    My only point here is that the amount of law enforcement should reflect the actual need rather than a fixed ratio of population to staffing. And of course there needs to be some ‘reserve’ capability for unusual events. But thats what mutual assistance agreements and being on call are for. I wonder how many sworn law enforcement people of all Government levels there actually are in HumCo? I’ll bet its more than I’d guess.

  36. High Finance
    May 26, 2011 at 3:39 pm

    It would be interesting to see how much money the county spent on the homeless in 1975 compared to today.

    In tough financial times it all comes down to priorities.

  37. Plain Jane
    May 26, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    It’s quite a mystery why in hard times with record home foreclosures spending on the homeless increases, if you’re an idiot.

  38. Jim Ferguson
    May 26, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    We survived the 1992 cutbacks when the same thing occurred, we’ll survive this, though it wasn’t pretty then and it won’t be pretty now.

    Talking to a HCSO deputy at the time, I asked him what we should do, how should we address problems? His answer – Shoot, shovel and shut up.

    Twenty years later, nothing much has changed and it’s still pretty good advice.

  39. wurking stiff
    May 26, 2011 at 6:12 pm

    In general, I don’t have any lover lost for cops, but that doesn’t mean I don’t want them to exist, just perform professionally and courteously.

    That said, the juxtposition of population and police coverage in the chart is perfectly legitimate.

    Consider that there are mutual aid agreements between police agencies providing support by CHP, HCSD, and municipal police. This means that sherrifs DO provide some coverage to municipalites– not a lot, but they are backup for EPD, APD, FPD, etc.

    Also, while there has been less growth in the unincorporated areas than in the cities, they have nevertheless grown and reductions in sheriffs dept coverage means less police service than there was before.

    Also, we know in fact that EPD has been understaffed consistently (except for a brief period recently), and that under the Arklinati regime that PD is a lower budget priority than the zoo so in fact there is a LOT LESS coverage overall.

    the question i guess is whether the folks deep in the hills deserve police services or whether they will fall by the wayside.

  40. May 26, 2011 at 6:16 pm

    My point was that a gun locked in a closet with a lock on it and bullets in a separate drawer does zero for self protection.

    Concealed carry should be every non felons right in the USA. How could you be a “minute man” if it takes you hours to go get and unlock your gun?

    I know my progressive friends differ with me on this issue but hey what can I say I believe in self defense.

  41. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 6:41 pm

    That said, the juxtposition of population and police coverage in the chart is perfectly legitimate.

    Consider that there are mutual aid agreements between police agencies providing support by CHP, HCSD, and municipal police. This means that sherrifs DO provide some coverage to municipalites– not a lot, but they are backup for EPD, APD, FPD, etc.

    Sorry, but it is still NOT a legitimate comparison. Yes, there are mutual aid agreements between departments so that the sheriffs do (occasionally) respond to incidents within city limits. But it also works the other way around, where municipal police officers also respond to incidents outside the city limits.

    So those two factors pretty much cancel each other out, and we’re left with the unfortunate fact that this chart includes ALL the population in the county, but leaves out something like half of the law enforcement officers. It’s misleading as heck.

    They should come up with a chart that includes ALL law enforcement officers and compares that to the total population, and then it will be a meaningful comparison (within that overall picture, it would be appropriate to note how much of that population is in the sheriffs’ jurisdiction and how many sheriff’s deputies there are to meet those needs).

    Otherwise it’s just an exercise in propaganda. Which, I guess, was its intended purpose — to exaggerate the understaffing issues and scare the citizenry into supporting increased funding for the department so that the deputies do not have to accept any decrease in pay or increase in workload. And I can understand that — after all, the HDSO is essentially a labor union which is doing its best to maintain good pay and working conditions for its members during a time of budgetary cutbacks. I’d just rather that they do this without distorting the facts, and I’d be a lot more comfortable defending their side of the argument if it was not based on manipulated statistics.

    Like I said above, I’m actually sympathetic to the view that the sheriff’s office is being forced to shoulder too much of the burden of the current round of cutbacks. And I suspect that a more inclusive and accurate chart would still support that view, though perhaps not so dramatically.

    As a result of their attempt to mislead, I’m now kind of conflicted over whether to sign the petition on their website. On the one hand, I do think we should try to find a way to keep the McKinleyville and Garberville substations open, but on the other hand I hate to reward the HDSO for its exaggeration and scaremongering. If it hadn’t been for this misleading propagandistic chart, it would have been an easy decision for me, I would have signed that petition in a heartbeat. I guess instead of signing the petition, I’ll just send a personal letter to my Supervisor, noting both my support for the substations, and my disappointment with HDSO’s attempts to mislead the public about overall staffing levels.

  42. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 6:50 pm

    I found the following suggestion among the comments on the Lost Coast Outpost thread on the same topic:

    2livitup said: I believe that the Sheriff’s Dept. should do a manpower assessment. It would show all calls responded to, the day of the week and time. Then we determine whether deputies are scheduled where and when crime typically occurs. How much time is spent in areas covered by other responders? This assessment has been done by other Sheriff Departments in California.


    Seems like a good suggestion. But I don’t know, perhaps they have already done this kind of analysis? If so, I’d like to see the results.

  43. tra
    May 26, 2011 at 7:13 pm


    I generally would agree with your point about the need for people to be prepared to defend themselves (especially folks who are in remote areas — clearly even with good law enforcement funding there wasn’t going to be a staffed sheriff’s substation in tiny Kettenpom). In fact I’d go even farther than you and say that unless someone’s felony conviction involved a violent crime, then I really don’t see any good reason to take away their Second Amendment rights either.

    But the question of how guns and ammo should be stored can get to be a pretty tricky issue, for example if there are children in the home (or children who visit the home). Having a loaded gun easily accessible has obvious advantages in a self-protection situation…but obvious drawbacks from a child-safety point of view.

    But really the only reason that I responded to your earlier post was that you replied directly to Kym’s comment about the Kettenpom murders by saying…

    I would say that the murders were a direct result of gun laws that are too strict and a population that fears owning and using weapons for self defense. When guns are hard to own legally only criminals will own guns.

    …and clearly those particular murders were NOT a good example of the “then only criminals will own guns” dynamic. So basically my objection was to (what seemed to me to be) a knee-jerk Second Amendment reaction to those Kettenpom murders, even though the specific details of those murders really don’t support the point you were trying to make.

  44. The Big Picture
    May 26, 2011 at 8:55 pm

    Teacher says:
    May 26, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    “Are you suggesting that local developers are at fault for our local economy and that the recession we are in is not a direct result of the economic woes of our state and our country”?

    The local development community played their equal role in exploiting the public’s infrastructure to build larger, more profitable homes the public couldn’t afford, then used those now-famous tricks and traps to sell them to unqualified buyers….these loans were bundled, resold and the world economy collapsed.

    Planning an economy to serve the wealthy works great, for awhile…

    May 26, 2011 at 9:13 pm

    Kym Kemp says:
    May 26, 2011 at 9:02 am
    The murders just two months ago in Kettenpom with the subsequent injuries of the neighbors, Jim and Norma Gund, show what can happen if there are too little officers for too much area. Definitely the Gund’s would have been spared their ordeal and possibly even Kristin and Sky would still be alive if Kristin’s 911 call could have received immediate attention.

    Response: Hmmm, usually, murderers don’t wait long enough for a “police negotiator” to become involved, let alone sheriff’s deputies finding their way on back hill-billy roads. I doubt seriously anything would have changed with regard to what the criminal did. In these cases, usually “clean-up” paperwork is all, as sad as reality is that “guardian angels” can’t loom near by all our life.

    Anyhow, I listened to “The Point” and heard the ad repeatedly. I scoffed because the “guy speaking” makes it sound like the CAO is not making hard cuts elsewhere; and, wants to hide the fact that supervisors are supporting the CAO and traveling WITH THE CAO TO TOWN HALL SORTA MEETINGS. Then, the ad is paid for by the public employees/reps (union?), so obviously they want their jobs; the Wild West calamity statement (as if the rural areas are served any better or worse compared to yesterday, last year, 10 years ago, 100 years ago, etc…, especially with dead hitch-hikers and such from time to time and no cat-calls for more deputies).

    The response times are, well, they depend on the volume of requests and the hierarchy of crimes or incidents….can’t imagine being halfway through a report for one call to have to split for a worse call.

    Then, lets discuss one of the blogs more favorite points of emphasis or discussion….. graphs/charts/lists.

    Let’s discuss the call/incident list and what types of calls and incidents make up categories within that list. Then, consider how many on-site visits did not make it onto any list. Then, consider how many of those “on-site visits” turned out to be a waste of energy because the caller was deceiving or creating false impressions for public safety need, etc…..

    Now, the doozy, how many first responders actually caused trouble for the “alleged” victim who calls? Ya see folks, when sheriff deputies do bad things to certain folks in certain situations, especially motivated by politics or some other area of a public/personal vendetta concern/issue, there will be times when the service rendered and paid for by taxpayers was unjustified in so far as offering that public safety officer any employment. In other words, no sheriff deputy can justify their job when they don’t do it to begin with and then cause problems upon arrival and intervention, sometimes illegally upon themself, for the adverse damages they cause to the victim – mental, physical or both.

    So, with that said, in-house finances could be helped by better management, not responding to non-emergency calls where no property damage or other “heightened crime or incident” occured. For simple squabbles, let it be and let the judicial tier of government dictate what occurs. In fact, the role of the Sheriff’s Department seems over-inflated. As far as financing the Sheriff’s Department, well McKinleyvillians should remember their oath of AGREEMENT they took when the McKinleyville Community Plan was adopted and certified – that funding for law enforcement was a problem, and this is over 10 years ago. Yet, again, how efficient and what wastes don’t the general public see on any public safety lists.

    So, why not all the concerned public safety folks…… DO WHAT THE JEFFERSON NEIGHBORHOOD DID – start a fund drive where citizens can donate…..should be easy since all the clamorers and clamorettes for school bonds and such should have no problem paying more money without the need for another bond measure since it is always the groupees who concoct the financial tax schemes….where as they have the ability to pay twice as much for their efforts to transfer wealth outta other peoples pockets…..other people who won’t fund because they fall opposite than the chearleader section of local political groupee manipulators.

    As far as the County, Risk Management needs some “fine-tuning”, especially in the area of “getting back the insurance policy monies owed from the accidents and damages that the insurance company’s policy holders caused to “COUNTY MAINTAINED ASSETS” – like roads, ditches, curbs, waterways, etc….on and on and on…..did I not say I dislike insurance companies!!!!!!!!

    Jeffrey Lytle
    McKinleyville – 5th District

  46. Matt
    May 26, 2011 at 9:28 pm

    The county animal shelter (run by the Sheriff’s Dept) is going to take a huge hit in this budget crunch too.

  47. Jon Brooks
    May 26, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    To answer the original TRA question; Prop 13 happened in 1976, Jerry Browns surplus kept funding pretty much intact until 1978 or so, after that, its a steep drop for those local government services that people actually want, i.e., police, streets, water/sewer, etc. Instead, we cut police, road patching/maintenance, and even janitors and field crews who keep our buildings and parks clean and enjoyable.

    We need to do away with exemptions on property taxes owned by corporations, non-profits and religious property owners, and start taxing income on an equitable basis. Or, go to another system altogether that generates revenues in an equitable way. And, get serious about being more efficient with our public monies.

  48. May 26, 2011 at 10:02 pm

    As someone that was a lifelong martial artist and a martial arts instructor, as well as a survival trainer, I sleep with a pocket knife in my PJ’s. Like the boys scouts say “always be prepared”.

    May 26, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    Some good stuff Jon regarding who currently (didactics of faith) is not paying or those under-paying (corps); yet, it is hard to deny that a surplus back then was also due to “smaller governance”.

    As for efficiency (I agree); and, code enforcement for the “Public Works” is in order since so many lazy people impact the public infrastructure…..rock drive-ways, garbage, lawn clippings, parked vehicles like trailors, business U-Haul tractor-trailers, etc…..on and on and on….cha-ching!

    Even local community services districts could consider taking the fire hydrant water load-tests and instead of draining onto street, stick the hose into a water tanker and make a better use for the water than down the curb. Maybe use the water at local community gardens, storage for whatever, who knows. People are idea inflated, so no lack of thought or consideration.


  50. High Finance
    May 27, 2011 at 7:47 am

    Does anyone here think the MAC Center should take its share of the spending cuts ?

  51. Plain Jane
    May 27, 2011 at 8:25 am

    Sure, HiFi. When you have high unemployment, increased poverty and homelessness, cutting funding to MAC is the perfect solution.

  52. Mr. Nice
    May 27, 2011 at 8:32 am

    Does anyone here think the MAC Center should take its share of the spending cuts ?

    Think? Yup. Charities should be handling those programs. Government bureaucracies handling this is a disaster.

    Been on food stamps before. One month got $16. Got to thinking what kinna bullshit system has folks filling out hella forms to get 16 fucking dollars? Wasn’t about to hand it back like y’all can keep this, fuck that, but got to thinking they must be bleeding money somewhere to only kick down $16.

    Cut all that assistance center shit too but don’t forget to cut back on all them cops first. Ain’t like they bureaucracy doing better. Ain’t like because it is cops that makes them waste our money any different than the RCAA or the school system. They all got the same kinna knuckleheads running they shit. Only reason there is a need for cops is lack of jobs and money for the people. Who the fuck would the popo roll if everybody had a job?

  53. Anonymous
    May 27, 2011 at 8:35 am

    If the Sheriff’s Deputies organization is so concerned about funding cuts, why did it just vote no on a contract that offered no salary increases this year? I’m having kind of a hard time buying the public safety argument, and all in all the scare tactics are a complete turn-off.

  54. High Finance
    May 27, 2011 at 8:40 am

    There was an article in the Times Standard that had the MAC people proudly proclaiming it help 29 families last year.

    TWENTY NINE ! At a cost to the taxpayers of over ONE MILLION dollars a year !

    A Google search found a 2004 article about how the MAC proponents proclaimed the MAC would end homelessness in Humboldt County within ten years.

    How is that going for us ?

  55. Plain Jane
    May 27, 2011 at 8:45 am

    It was my understanding that the reason the sheriffs voted no on the contract was because of the tier system which would pay future hires less with fewer benefits. Such systems are ripe for abuse and encourage forcing long term employees out in favor of newer, cheaper employees.

    May 27, 2011 at 8:50 am


    furloughing is different than losing something. Ya see, it is like a business does ever so often in a pinch when it comes to falsely justifying a certain base level of price gougings. Ya see, instead of lowering the “rate”, the manipulators will shave off hours. It is all about base level economics and once the fraud “sets-in”, base level charges/rates, etc… are the LAST THING TO DROP UNDER PRESSURE OF POLITICS.


    The Public Tax collection valuation schemes – taxes are collected based on values….the higher the value (even labor charges, wages and rates), the higher the base level of tax revenues to be generated. The last thing the deputies want the public to understand is that they are all over-paid AND IF deputies are not all paid exactly the same way, animosity is used as the ruse to fear tactic the taxpayers to “pay-off” the launderers(public empoyees and their union frack friends) who are already over-compensated as a political tool for election votes and special interest abuses.

    Too many people need to “buck-up” and provide for their own public safety servicings or learn how to be less of a “chicken’schit, whining little poohbear” who cries wolfy too often.

    Again as is the situation, it is the “Family Unit” and “Women and Children first” attitude that is partly creating huge debts in this country.


    Power and Control through intentional and false social symbiosis for Public Safety, at times. People need to rely on their “individual” constitutional freedoms to deal with criminals, not give-up those freedoms for a 3rd party servicing first responder paid by for by many of the taxpayers who don’t need or want the service.


    May 27, 2011 at 8:58 am

    The system is already rife with abuse PJ. This is because every public employee is “most likely” over-paid and over-benefitted. So, I’ll welcome less expensive and less greedy humanoids to serve the taxpayers. Let the greedy, arrogant types go (women deputies too are quick mouthed power control freakettes)….good riddance to both genders (even glbt’s) if they are so above us taxpayers.


  58. Plain Jane
    May 27, 2011 at 8:58 am

    That is such a deceitful claim, HiFi. You must be taking lessons from Rose. What the T-S article actually said was that they had helped 29 homeless families get permanent homes, not that they helped 29 families. They helped 100 families with housing which was stated in the article. MAC offers services besides housing the homeless including case work, monitoring, and the assessment and treatment of public and mental health issues.


    May 27, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Tax collectors would rather have “price gougings” instead of lower prices where more people would have an economic and social opportunity to own a home. Mixed in with “affordable housing tax scam launderings”, the folks that politicise AH, etc… all are protecting Power through Tax collections over-stated and over-burdened. Why? Public Employee Greeds, public tax dollar bailouts of ALL MAKES AND MODELS OF ALL THINGS PEOPLE AND MONEY, continued expansions of government, etc…

    Stick a fork in it, it is a charred London Broil.


  60. Mr. Nice
    May 27, 2011 at 9:26 am

    Word JL, folks in jail speak on them ads for cops with that $3-$5 grand salary range. Folks is jealous. Say if they made even three on the regular they wouldn’t pitch dope, they’d buy a house. But cops get paid this kinna cabbage for what? For being all up in our communities picking that low-hanging fruit and shit. For keeping my peoples living in fear of arrest for the benefit of some bougie white boys’ racist mentalities.

    Crooked cops is everywhere. A cop’s salary ain’t really all that when you got the dope man with a wad in his sock bigger than that cop see all year. Now we got corruption. Now we got cops taking bribes just like the same politicians who run this country and this state into debt be taking bribes.

    Once we got cop bribery the only folks who lose are those without that bribe money. Don’t care if you call a bribe the cop who didn’t get they money or the court system didn’t get they bail or them lawyers who didn’t get that retainer.

    Even if you lock a dope man up we got those on the inside taking bribes and blackmail and all that pussy shit. How in the fuck did haystack or haymaker or whatever the fuck start smuggling heroin? How inna fuck we got Yochum get ten motherfucking bundles and only get popped with 16.1 grams in his cell? Corrupt ass government, reason #1.

    Got to say, how inna fuck a painkiller cause so much pain and so much killing? The motherfucking government. Fuck the police. Fuck the system. Fuck those who speak on racist shit to protect that status quo. Just because our people get juvenile detention don’t mean the people can’t be productive members of society if given a chance.

    If they government cut our cop money, don’t trip. If you ain’t had gun cleaner, get some. Invest in some red devil yadada mean.

    We can all cry for some dope fiend logic stealing food out the kitchen shack but ain’t nobody know a thing once them vultures swoop on that body. Ain’t like the Garberville substations really have to do shit anyway.

    And for Mack Town, we know who killed Black from motherfucking Topix, not the cops. Did they investigators even find the body?

  61. retired guy
    May 27, 2011 at 9:58 am

    Look, all you out there who think local government employees are overpaid need to realize who you’re comparing these employees with. Are you comparing them with small private employers, large private employers, other public employers, or what? If you want to get well qualified employees and keep them, you can’t pay them lousy wages. Turnover is one of the most costly things an employer can face. If a job is relatively complex, training is required, and if your turnover is high due to low wages, this is just a continuing problem that doesn’t go away.

    So, if you value your employees and consider them an asset to your operation, pay is a strong motivator. Well trained valuable employees make for an efficient and consistent workforce. As is said, you get what you pay for.

  62. Plain Jane
    May 27, 2011 at 10:18 am

    Are our public safety employees worth less than, say, PG&E or AT&T employees? Are their jobs less dangerous? Should they have fewer benefits? It’s so odd that as the middle class is shrinking like wool in boiling water so many middle and formerly middle class people are trying to turn up the heat. Cutting working class wages / jobs in any sector impacts every sector. It reduces government revenues, increases social costs and reduces consumer spending, causes bankruptcies and home foreclosures; all of which leads to more wage cuts and job losses. Some people haven’t learned anything in the past few decades.

  63. Teacher
    May 27, 2011 at 10:59 am

    Locally, teachers top out at around 70k per year with top-notch benefits, great job security, and tons of vacation. It’s not that they’re over-paid, it’s just that the argument that they are not paid enough or that they can’t afford cutbacks like the rest of the workforce is B.S. If you are a business employee, and the business’s profit margins shrink (i.e. Security National), you suffer greatly. Employees of the gov’t need to realize that when the well dries up, they need to be willing to absorb some of the hit. Seems to me that many gov’t employees (police, teachers, etc) are unwilling to shoulder any of the burden of these difficult times just like the private sector.

  64. Fact Checker
    May 27, 2011 at 11:08 am

    High Finance says:
    May 27, 2011 at 8:40 am

    “There was an article in the Times Standard that had the MAC people proudly proclaiming it help (sic) 29 families last year.

    TWENTY NINE ! At a cost to the taxpayers of over ONE MILLION dollars a year !”

    As usual, no facts, just spewing anger. Financial types have been so much better for America than those like Betty Chin and MAC who are trying to help Americans who are down. No Class Finance, Why do you hate homeless Americans so much? Especially in light of the disproportionate amount of Homeless-Veteran-Americans?

  65. The Big Picture
    May 27, 2011 at 11:34 am

    That’s what you get when you engage a provocateur…fact-free drivel, like the propaganda offered by “Teacher”:

    “When the well dries up…”

    Deceitful propaganda like this brings great swells of joy to the benefactors of corporate-welfare “bailouts”, offshore tax havens, unprecedented tax cuts, the bloated military industrial complex engaged in perpetual wars of choice, or even our local development community ready to begin the 3rd housing bubble since the 1980’s…at the expense of unfunded public infrastructure and services.

    The public is being fleeced while propagandists call for austerity!?


  66. skippy
    May 27, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Many good comments and opinions by everyone here. Our lone fiscal conservative, Hi-Fi, has his contrary but realistic pondering points to consider as well.

    No one has dared opine if County employees should return to a 37.5 hour work week— as we did in the fiscal crisis of 1992. This worked reasonably well with all things considered.

    The 37.5 hour week saved employees from being layed off and unceremoniously dumped onto the unemployment line, spared public safety and substations, and equally spread the cuts and sacrifice amongst all until the economy recovered– without raising taxes.

    ”That’s really a drastic reduction in service,” (Supervisor Clif) Clendenen said. “We’re going to be sharpening the pencils all summer here to try to avert that.”

    More of this issue in today’s Times-Standard article by Jessica Cejnar, “Deputy Sheriffs’ Organization Protests Potential Sheriff Station Closures”

  67. Fact Checker
    May 27, 2011 at 1:33 pm

    skippy says:
    May 27, 2011 at 1:02 pm
    “No one has dared opine if County employees should return to a 37.5 hour work week– as we did in the fiscal crisis of 1992.”

    County employees have been 37.5 hours per week since 1992.

  68. What Now
    May 27, 2011 at 1:49 pm

    The Humboldt County Sheriff’s Department have been out of control thugs for generations.
    I now look forward to Highly Fried’s rebuttal based on “scientific” speculations published in a 10 year old issue of The National Enquirer.

  69. Mrs. White
    May 27, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    The trades unions will be one of the agencies that will bring upon this earth a time of trouble such as has not been since the world began.

  70. Chicken Little
    May 27, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    Mrs. White says:
    May 27, 2011 at 2:10 pm
    “The trades unions will be one of the agencies that will bring upon this earth a time of trouble such as has not been since the world began.”

    The sky is falling! The sky is falling!

  71. skippy
    May 27, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    Only a minority of employee positions are at 37.5 hours presently. This information comes from the CAO’s office– today. They further stated, and clearly, that “the majority of County employees are currently at 40 hours per week, and not at 37.5.”

    An AFSCME (the County employee’s union, separate from the HDSO union) representative further confirmed this fact to yours truly several days ago. While a few minority 37.5 hour positions do still exist, these are contained within 3 County departments but are by position only, and not by department. The majority of County positions are now at 40 hours per week, the AFSCME representative said.

    Unless you know more, the majority of County employees are not working the slightly reduced work week. As an example, the Probation Department has since moved from 37.5 hours to a 40 hour work week years ago.

    May 27, 2011 at 7:41 pm


    Hi-Fi is less fiscally conservative than myself, just a reference of thought. Now, being socially moderate, I can understand why far lefters and far righters hate my guts – neither side wants to lose conventional political power and control, really.


    May 27, 2011 at 7:58 pm

    retired guy says:
    May 27, 2011 at 9:58 am
    Look, all you out there who think local government employees are overpaid need to realize who you’re comparing these employees with. Are you comparing them with small private employers, large private employers, other public employers, or what? If you want to get well qualified employees and keep them, you can’t pay them lousy wages. Turnover is one of the most costly things an employer can face. If a job is relatively complex, training is required, and if your turnover is high due to low wages, this is just a continuing problem that doesn’t go away.

    So, if you value your employees and consider them an asset to your operation, pay is a strong motivator. Well trained valuable employees make for an efficient and consistent workforce. As is said, you get what you pay for.

    Response: Yep, it is aboyut the money and benefits, your right….and to think these chumps are honest when they say they have a public employment job because they want to make a positive difference in the community,,,positive being their paychecks and power trips.

    Hey, ya know what de-motivation is? It is liars who manipulate and deceive while being in a position of power. With unemployment so high, I doubt seriously your claim that good employees can’t be found who will accept lower pay and benefits (provided the county busts the union because the union will fight hard to keep its unjustifiable high pay packages with perks and benefits).

    As far as a continuing problem of low wages and qualified employees…..hmmm, this is why enough are gettin in hot water and the county can’t fire them very easily. No need to retain buffoons who bungle their public duties and obligations.

    Public employment pays too much – this is the scam for votes that elected officials ruse the general public over.


    Hire more people as dependent public employees so that when election time comes around in Humboldt County, the votes of those employees will follow who will keep them their high pay with perks and benefits jobs. Same thing for the States and for the FED. It is the retention of power through public employment – no public employee would ever want to lose the “silver spooned gift” they receive while employed by taxpayes when they know the private sector can’t duplicate or use public tax dollars to “prop-up” paid public employment positions. So, if these public employees want to keep their high pay, then I demand tax dollars to pay me the difference that the unions are “raking in” above and beyond the limits that private sector folks are “cut-off” at.

    Stick a fork in the economy, nothing good is gonna occur until major overhaul – and, actually, it is about time because too many people have failed their responsibilities as humans, countrymen and countrywomen. When Americans get back to respecting one another, parents get back to their duties and obligations, the size of government decreases, greed is less, lies are less, deceits are less, etc…everyday, one more item on the checklist needs affirmation for healing.


  74. Anon
    May 27, 2011 at 9:06 pm

    Let’s put a face on a “government workers.” I am one, having work in the jail for 20 years. After 20 years of service I make about $20 an hour, earn a few weeks of vacation a year, and have medical benefits. I am grateful to have a job.
    But here’s the thing. When I applied for a job in the jail, I certainly wasn’t thinking, “I hope the well doesn’t dry up. This is going to be a great, cushy gig!” There was nothing sneaky or sinister about trying to get the job. I wasn’t thinking about a “gravy train.” What I was thinking (among other things) was, “I hope I get this job because I have bills to pay.” I would guess that is what most applicants of any job are thinking. Since I got the job, I show up for my shift, work hard in a difficult environment, and try to go home safely at the end of the day. When I’m not at work I am no different than you. I watch my children play Little League, attend parent/teacher conferences, and I worry about my PG&E bill. I struggle to make ends meet, working paycheck to paycheck. I pay taxes and sometimes complain they are too high. But I work holidays and night shift too. That means I don’t get to be there to carve the turkey or watch my children open their presents Christmas morning. But I knew what I was applying, and again, I am grateful to have a job.
    However, at work I am neither a policy maker nor a manager. Therefore, I will not accept responsibility for California’s fiscal crisis. And I will not apologize for working for the government. I work very hard for every penny I earn and I provide a service to the community I live in. As I stated earlier, I show up for work, do my job well, and go home. The accusation that I am not willing to “shoulder any of the burden . . . like the private sector” is outrageous. In the jail, we have watched the number of officers dwindle while our inmate population remains unchanged. How much of the burden should I shoulder? I work in a place where people get hurt when there are not enough officers. That’s real.
    And I remain grateful to have a job.

  75. skippy
    May 27, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    Well and honestly said, Anon. The HCCF is a difficult environment that few know of on a day-to-day basis. 20 years? Congratulations. Most CO’s hardly stay that in it for that long with the extremely stressful, ever-changing, and yes– the sometimes unsafe and dangerous conditions. It takes its toll.

    Yours truly is pleased you’ve stayed the course, held the line, and built up your seniority by consistently showing up for the past 20 years. This is no easy feat. It took a lot for you to be vetted, hired, evaluated, and to stay there. We’ve been through these tough fiscal times in 1992. From my experience, we’ll get through this again.

    This is why a 37.5 hour week for County employees should be revisited. We kept the Jail and safety positions staffed in 1992 by spreading the budget cuts and sacrifice equally out for all. Yours truly doesn’t believe this would affect you, either; the Jail must be fully staffed, as mandated, 24 hours a day, as you already know.

    Anon, my hat is off to you. Please stay the course. You’ve done well. Thank you for your post.

    May 27, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    Not to pinch yet another nub,

    but anon above, what made you decide to “train and be educated” for a government job in order to be a public employee?

    Was it the benefits and the pay?

    Was it the idea of not owning and operating a business?

    Also, what was your starting pay back 20 years ago and how much in benefits has been subsidized by taxpayers over the 20 years. Just curious because growing-up, many parents said if you want a cush job with benefits, work for the government.

    We all work hard don’t we? I guess it is a matter of opinion, but last I checked, no two people work exactly the same output, yet unions tend to treat people like they all work the same hard work as equals…..which is not humanly possible.

    Well, as someone said, Rome was not built in a day. Drop us a note when the released state prisoners hit the Humboldt County jail free of charge. Should make for better working conditions when the attached funding can be secured.


  77. Anon
    May 27, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    Mr. Lytle,
    Feel free to come work in the jail. I would suggest that after just one shift you would never call it a “cush job” again. Of course, if you applied, I suspect you could not pass the psych test.

    May 28, 2011 at 6:13 am


    Wow, psychological mind games, just like they teach ya during training camp. So, no answer for the wage pay, back 20 years ago? Also, it was those former parents who said if ya want a cush job, work for the government…apparantly, you took the elders’ advice.

    Myself, cush can mean many things – like that which is attached to the public labor that is not attached to private sector labor because private sector jobs are apparantly, in your opining defense, not as hard and are more cush than government jobs. Sigh, another nameless and faceless deceitful person too scared to discuss honestly the tax funded environment – even as a law enforcement employee who is trained to be a tough guy nonetheless wiser.

    Feel lucky you have Skippy’s tepid “sugar-coating” of this issue to make you feel better, since “well and honestly said” describes a person who avoids answering legitimate and important, issue based questions. I doubt anon’s employment lacked pre-meditated thought with respect to what the public jail job was going to encounter prior to the 20 years of service. If ya wanna be in the game, ya gotta play the game. It is not as if anon only had one-calling in life to be in a power and control position serving the bureaucrats who use the prison system wrecklessly, nah…never.

    Anyhow, Anon, I will at least say that “the jailed” are often receiving way too much in amenities above and beyond the basics. In fact, I question why “real law abiding people” are paying taxes but receiving less “standards” than “the imprisoned”. Not your deal, but this does make a”a Jailers job” more difficult, imo. Why? More responsibilities and liabilities.

    Another “not your deal” is the street deputies. Obviously, street deputies have “free range” to do whatever and however when not under the scope of another; whereas, a jailer such as yourself, is being monitored ever so often within confined areas and quarters. Yet, the funneling of drugs into the jail still occurs for the exchange of sexual deviated favors, but I know you still have a job, so your safe; and, that drug thing is not your deal.


    May 28, 2011 at 6:34 am

    retired guy says:
    May 27, 2011 at 9:58 am
    Look, all you out there who think local government employees are overpaid need to realize who you’re comparing these employees with. Are you comparing them with small private employers, large private employers, other public employers, or what? If you want to get well qualified employees and keep them, you can’t pay them lousy wages. Turnover is one of the most costly things an employer can face. If a job is relatively complex, training is required, and if your turnover is high due to low wages, this is just a continuing problem that doesn’t go away.

    So, if you value your employees and consider them an asset to your operation, pay is a strong motivator. Well trained valuable employees make for an efficient and consistent workforce. As is said, you get what you pay for.

    Response: Yet another post that implies that society is overly stupid and dumb, thus limiting the number of qualified applicants for public employment. Funny how these claims of superiority filter out when the “public subsidies” get threatened. I guess the parents who said that government jobs are “cush”, never expected the taxpayers to “wake-up”.


    May 28, 2011 at 6:36 am

    In the short term to near future, merely having a job will trump whatever pay for so many. Only the well positioned, socially and financially, will be able to “stall the penury”.


  81. Popeye
    May 28, 2011 at 8:16 am

    To make matters worse, because of our broke State, according to Dist. Att. Gallegos, approx. 200 criminals from prisons will be released without serving their full term..all coming back to Humboldt. These are not prisoners that were incarcerated for just smoking a joint! We need our sheriff’s department’s protection in McKinleyville, Garberville, and Hoopa. All citizens should be protected. That is governments job. We have many areas that could be cut. Caltrans is a good place to start. I am sick and tired of govenment officials frightening citizens every time the state comes up short because of their excessive spending. The cut of the Sheriff’s office deputies, has always been a fear lever that government uses. Gallegos recently had the nerve to say that….because proposition 13 was enacted…we are in this fix! Who is he kidding? Don’t cut our Sheriff’s!!!

  82. Plain Jane
    May 28, 2011 at 8:27 am

    Because limiting tax revenues has absolutely nothing to do with our problems funding government services, Popeye?

  83. High Finance
    May 28, 2011 at 8:53 am

    Do you realize, PJ, that California already has one of the highest income tax rates in the nation ?

    Last I read, counting state tax revenues of all kinds, California was the 12th highest taxed state.

    May 28, 2011 at 9:05 am

    Always those who want to use other people’s money for financing their social schemes…………above and beyond the basic provisions government is to constituionally provide. The one thing about Prop. 13 too is, government was smaller back when it was passed. Then, the bureaucrats had to find “new schemes” to force higher valuations cuz their property over-taxations were no longer an ability they could continue. Now, does that not sound nice, eliminating the ability of government to “OVERTAX”?

    The “Post Prop. 13” scheme, ruse if you will:

    Use regulation to force higher costs like more technical data paperwork, sprinkler systems in regular homes, affordable housing ruse or scheme through subsidies to hide California government abuse of “propping up real-estate and personal property values to false levels for higher tax collection returns to pay for the expansionisms of socialized government services.

    Hmm, I venture to BET that an insurance policy (premium coverage of value) on any given personal property or real-estate won’t match what value the government has givin. Why no match? A match suggests the pay-off is higher and we all know insurance is out to bank a buck on profit margins and tinkered policies and not your overtrusting surety.

    Then, another ruse………fascist arrangements with industry to allow re-bates, pre-bates, credits, etc… so that the POS transaction is higher, thus meaning that taxes are higher, both sales and on incomes, since jobs are created to waste energy by passing along the day passing along “fake” paperwork that is unnecessary when just merely lowering the pos transaction to its real value, which would be much better than inventing some now ya see it, now ya don’t sorta paperchase scheme. Then, don’t forget ALL THE EXTRA ENERGY THE CONSUMER MUST EXERT TO FULFILL THE CREDIT, REBATE, PREBATE, COUPON, ETC, SCHEME…

    Because government greed supported by individually greedy types who are mere political stool pigeons and minions have absolutely nothing to do with the national debt, corporate/public fascist arrangements, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, FHA, bailouts to whomever, Health Care, War, Illegal Immigration, Over-population, etc…

    Don’t fund the sheriff’s any more than necessary:-)

    Those releasees are being released to Humboldt County’s Jail, hopefully with funds from the state to house them as well since over-crowding in the state penetentiaries offered health concerns and code violations. The increased housing population locally should make for more whistling toward street-goers though.


  85. Plain Jane
    May 28, 2011 at 9:07 am

    And yet it’s the state with the highest GDP, HiFi. Have you seen the Texas budget deficit news with their much lower taxes? Taxing adequately to pay for what the citizens demand is a novel idea, but maybe we should give it a try.

    May 28, 2011 at 9:22 am

    Which citizens?

    Those who vote AFTER being brainfed fodder by those political pundits (commercialized or not, it don’t matter) who seek only to deceive the voter and consumer for their own ultimate benefit or agenda or ideolog, etc…

    In fact, when America has a bunch of non-citizens who affect the vote, one can understand how diversity ain’t all “cracked-up” as people make it to be.

    If immigrants can live in America as legal citizens, yet they are already en masse pre-entrained in their socialist views, totalitarianisms, etc… (what they are used to in so far as rule), then the way they (most immigrants who can’t be a dog which learns new tricks sts) vote is for government to provide their needs and wants. This is a fundamental, choreographed break-down of the country by its own government leaders in so far as what The People shall allow.

    Ya see, any intelligient person understands that the drive of government is to circumvent the U.S. Constitution by way of using fascist arrangements with business and people – let business make the guidelines and rules that control and over-power people because government can’t as easily – it is called consumer warranties and contracts that get people to agree to stuff that, had government attempted the same thing, the reults would be deemed as unconstitutional stuff…..let people being water-down in American ideology be the guinea pigs to destroy the country from within by and through their voting practices which are pre-determined for most based upon the government that once controlled them. America needs to rethink its population count to the downsizing reality that is before us as a human race.


  87. Down the Road
    May 28, 2011 at 10:28 am

    Most of the blogs are much to long to read in their
    entirety. This is just my opinion. This is another
    ruse to the voters to vote in more taxes. Phillip
    Crandall’s department of Health & Services budget
    is around 151,000,000 a year. The county’s whole
    population is just around l35,000. Do the math.
    If the county supervisor’s vote to cut the sheriff’s
    budget, I like the idea of picking the county supervisor for their area and every
    time something bad happens in their area, shackle
    them for a week in the public square.

  88. Another 2 cents
    May 28, 2011 at 10:58 am

    “immigrants….are already en masse pre-entrained in their socialist views….”

    What an idiotic bunch of responses! Entrained? Jesus.

    Dumbasses. If you’re going to talk taxes – forget 13 (or don’t, we’d be well rid of it) and get back to taxing the rich!

    No Sheriffs, in Garberville? Alderpoint? P-ville? Hoopa? Honeydew? Myers Flat?! It’s NUTS.

    How much more, ultimately, will it cost to set the Sheriffs up again? After what?

    They gonna use private-contractors (with what kind of standards?) to clear the way for the log trucks going into R. Grove? Or will there still be Sheriffs here long enough to ram that through?

    Murders? They don’t really care if we kill each other…..It makes things look bad though.

    Downey knows better – who’s pulling the strings?

    May 28, 2011 at 10:58 am

    Besides the fact we have a “structured society” based upon “U.S. Constitutional language of laws and rules”, why again are people still the same as when governement never existed?

    So, darned society if we don’t; and, darned society if we do. Hmmm, if more people acted better as a human-being should act respectfully, there would be less dependent types created that fend off others. Now, explain again how a new baby is born, then raised, then let loose upon society to raise all hell. Could it be the family unit is soured; parents in greater numbers are failing their responsibilites; government is derelict on its liabilities after overly and inappropriately subsidizing all things social problems and running outta money; voters who vote bond measures and other populist tax schemes when no money exists or the ruse falls apart at the seams when the variables and associated figures used in the tax scheme models “CHANGE” for worse.

    Like school bonds based on valuations that no longer exist which changes the terms at minimum, but do the taxpayers understand this and what the new terms are after the fact? Nope.

    Talk about blind faith and trust for the PR campaigner groupees.


  90. High Finance
    May 28, 2011 at 11:02 am

    Different types of industries PJ.

    But I was wrong, California is the TENTH highest taxed state. Texas is 49th.

    California unemployment rate in April ? 11.9%
    Texas ? 8.0

  91. Plain Jane
    May 28, 2011 at 11:10 am

    So what, HiFi? Texas isn’t taxing enough to pay for the government Texans demand and California isn’t taxing enough to pay for the government we demand. Texas has the highest property tax rate in the country and California has one of the lowest.

    May 28, 2011 at 11:30 am

    Another 2 Cents,

    is upset and scared at the same time….. exibiting a neurasthenia episode or event, apparantly.

    Hey, now if Americans moved en masse to Poland or Iran, I bet they would change the environment too by their vote opposite of what that culture historically lived-out.

    Just sayin’ money don’t grow on trees for the U.S. scam for votes and foreign born agenda schemes to “re-shape the social fabric of rights and privileges” through intentionally flawed immigration responsibilities. Time to de-populate to sustainable and healthy levels by dealing with immigration flaws, then those who have more kids than they can afford and keep healthy with their own personal finances and not that of taxpayers. That would be an appropriate and legitimate two areas to start cleaning out the political dirty pocket handlers of petty change thta adds up to a whole lot of DEBT.

    When a person thinks about the quality of their life, do they consider that quality of life of another? Usually not, at least until the sardine affect is in play and qualities are being taken away by the very same sardines who enter the can after you – and then what Native Americans experienced, for America is experiencing it again, but in a slightly amended manner using tax ruses and high societal costs.


    May 28, 2011 at 11:31 am


    falsely uses “we”, as if the minority of voters agrees with the majority of brainfed sheeple.


  94. Anonymous
    May 28, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    Despite its size, I was able to retire from my small business in Eureka after less than 15 years.

    During that time, I paid more in Federal taxes each year than my annual salary when I worked for the government!

    My California taxes were a tiny, insignificant percentage of my overall taxes, which partly explains the mess this state is in.

    Successful businesses like mine that can live and operate where we chose are attracted to a higher quality of community that California offers in spades. I would gladly pay higher taxes to invest in that quality of life.

    It’s good business, as Vermont is about to discover.

  95. Down the Road
    May 28, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    California shot itself in the foot when the priority
    became selective welfare. Selective welfare for
    the corporations and selective welfare for a level
    of society that the non-profits can corral,
    fed off and keep.

    Hi-Fi: If it is any consolation the MAC’s
    illegitimate birth rate dropped when the men were
    moved out. The MAC is another enterprise for RCAA
    to feed off.

  96. High Finance
    May 28, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    That chart PJ, includes ALL taxes like I said before, not just income taxes.

    12.40pm. You are typical in that you seriously under estimate the amount of state taxes that you pay. When you include state income taxes, sales taxes, property taxes and a myriad of “fees”, you pay more in state taxes than you do in federal income taxes.

  97. Anon
    May 28, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    Down the Road said: Phillip Crandall’s department of Health & Services budget is around 151,000,000 a year. The county’s whole population is just around l35,000. Do the math.

    Part of the math is that DHSS employs over 1,100 people. That is where a lot of his budget is going along with high monthly rents on a lot of buildings. The Professional Building on 5th Street started out at $48,000 plus a month and housed only 84 of the higher ups in the department. The rent there has gone up every year by 3% which makes it a lot of money and he has rented yet another floor in the same building. He may be spending around $130,000 on all of the places they have to rent but it could well be more than that.

  98. The Big Picture
    May 28, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    Fresh from making stuff up about the MAC, and without an ounce of shame, our resident idiot at 1:32PM would now have us believe that sales tax wasn’t already collected by a business before it is paid back!

    Obviously this fool has learned that his drivel and outright lies win momentary credibility when framed in reasonable-sounding language.

    He has no interest in debate, only provocation.

    How pathetic.

  99. Down the Road
    May 28, 2011 at 6:10 pm

    To partly understand what has happened to the state of California, you need to address what they did to
    business about 20 to 30 years ago. Worker’s Comp.
    was raised in most cases over 100%. You can thank
    State Fund for that. They were bending over backwards for any phony claim that came in. Then we can thank the ACLU for stopping the method of spot checking for illegal immigrants at that time in the work place.

    I doubt if many of you can grasp how devastating illegal immigration has hurt this state. They lowered the salaries. They have had anchor babies and collected welfare. California has spent huge amounts of money accommodating them in our schools. You can thank the dumb fu– liberals for all of this.

  100. Oliver"AL"Pedro
    May 28, 2011 at 6:29 pm

    How about cutting some of the Captains , the Lieutenants ,and other top brass. Not the people on the bottem.You can save more money with fewer lay off from the top than you from bottom.

  101. High Finance
    May 28, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    The Big Picture is a big fool.

    He is also a big liar as he posts here often but hides his lying posts under various assumed names. He is a troll who follows me around & says nothing but insults about me.

    He has no interest in debate, only provocation.

    How pathetic.

  102. taxed
    May 28, 2011 at 10:29 pm

    Anon 1:50 pm did you totally miss the point that DTR was making. Do the math, Get rid of Crandall the Tax Sucking Middle Man and his parasitical kingdom and everyone can get the money directly. Wow, Anon you are dense.

  103. taxed
    May 28, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Sorry Anon 1:50 I think I may have misunderstood YOUR post. I thought you were defending Crandall and his welfare kingdom. After reading more carefully I realize you were just stating the facts, about the huge overhead on the Crandall welfare business.

    May 29, 2011 at 8:43 am

    Down The Road is accurate with regard to STate Compensation Insurance Fund – The State don’t ru n it even though it has a “state” word. In Fact, it is a western regional insurance (WSIC or something like that) group committee that sets the rates while State Compensation gets busted for over-charging on premiums to over-charge business while running the money scam of interest income to ruse the state’s citizenry(a case about 4-5 years ago If I am remembering those days correctly). Those people at State Compensation Insurance Fund deserve to lose their jobs as well.

    Oops, are we slamming deceitful, minionated employees of public organizations and agencies too much – Hell No! They process the fraud, tax dollar launderings and power/control trips for higher pay and publicly subsidized benefits. Why? For the dirty work that the higher order of the establishment required in order to be biased in favor for the vote to re-elect the Power and Control treasonists. Ya, public employees are screened to be “the best of the best of the best”, a reaction I’ll let moviestar Will Smith’s “MIB” retort take-over…..


    May 29, 2011 at 9:03 am

    Down The Road,

    Many political liberals are not so dumb as thay are deceitful tax revenue launderers and corrupt liars, just like many political conservatives.

    It is the “DUALOPOLY” that his sabotaging this country “on purpose, with intention to destroy Americans from within, etc…” Hey, who else has let people into their home who ended-up turning on them at a later date?

    Hey, remember WW2, remember the Civil War, etc… these wars were won by using industry transportation and industry manufacturing. So, do tell me how the export of these jobs is not “a threat” to national security? Might as well put a “for sale sign up” and get some money before world war takes our country away because we have no means to manufacture like we used to back in the day. History repeats itself on a different shoreline. D-Day may just occur again, but on the eastern seaboard of the U.S..

    Think voters, think…or else lose it all. Then, the past few decades of immigrants will feel right at home again, sure thing, mostly voting like they always have….entrained by another country’s political regime.


    May 29, 2011 at 9:09 am

    What’s that show about being smarter than “5th Grader”.

    It is great, it shows the stupidity and dumbnesses of American adults.

    Now, the show should be reserved only for adults who are “Public Employees for government or other agencies/groups”. This would show a candid view or picture of the qualities public employees have and don’t have. It is unsettling to know that tax dollars are used to hire “rusers and schemers” who use tax dollars to hide and cover-over the abuses by the public employee types. I bet a public employee feels damn good to get off a wrong with the subsidizing financial aid of their victims.


  107. The Big Picture
    May 29, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    ****High Finance says:
    May 27, 2011 at 8:40 am

    “There was an article in the Times Standard that had the MAC people proudly proclaiming it help(ed) 29 families last year.

    TWENTY NINE ! At a cost to the taxpayers of over ONE MILLION dollars a year!”

    *****High Finance says:
    May 28, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    You are typical…you seriously under estimate (underestimate) the amount of state taxes that you pay…when you include SALES TAXES…”

    ****High Finance says:
    May 28, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    “(You’re) a…big lying troll…hiding behind assumed names who follows me around & says nothing but insults about me”. (ME ME ME It’s all about ME!).

    If it weren’t so sad, you would be a laugh riot Mr. “HiFi”, who Heraldo recently confirmed also posts under various names!

    Please use your occasional posts correcting others grammar to begin flogging yourself…

    Unless you’re a bed-ridden teen desperate to provoke others by making up stuff, please seek help. Anyone stupid enough to follow you around better wear a gas mask and bring a shovel.

  108. Anonymous
    May 29, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    According to the U.S. Dept. of Labor, owner-operated businesses represent a tiny fraction of workers-Comp. claims per-capita.

    Workplaces are safer when the owners are also inhabiting the building and operating the machines.

    Workers Comp. insurance is cheap if you know where to shop, operate a safe business, and treat your employees with respect.

  109. High Finance
    May 29, 2011 at 5:55 pm

    Serious question “Big Picture”. How old are you ?

  110. Down the Road
    May 29, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    Response to 12:28 PM: You obviously don’t know much
    about California’s W.C. No, it is not cheaper if you
    know where to shop. The cost is per $100.00 paid.
    I don’t know what warehouse W.C. is right now. But,
    it would not surprise me if it was up to $20.00 per $l00.00. Roofers are one of the highest. If you really knew about Ca. W.C. you would know these cost
    are set and not negotiable. If your accident rate is
    high, they the insurance agency adds a surcharge on
    the overall rate. It has been corrupt in Ca.
    One of the problems is the clinics that are cheating
    the business owner, that along with all of the
    employee cheaters.

    Plain Jane: The MAC center is costing the Eureka
    taxpayer $50,000 a year in house payments. The people staying there are coming in from all over.
    They draw SSI or any other welfare they can get
    from the taxpayer. You cannot justify the MAC
    no matter what you say. I keep saying do the math
    on the counties budget for health and services.
    If you divide l35,000 (population) into $151,000,000 each child and every adult in this county would walk
    away with over a million. The Mission offers the
    same services as the MAC and does so from donations. They have about 28 people there right now. Per captia there is no way in hell you need the MAC or most of the other non-profits here. Most of the “help” is duplications of services already available.

    As far as house foreclosures – Some who have recently lost their employment and did not take creative loans I feel badly for and would help them.
    Those that took creative loans I have no pity for.
    If you don’t understand what you’re signing, see an atty. To top it off, some people who received first
    time buyer loans withdrew all the equity in the house
    and then couldn’t make the payments.

  111. taxed
    May 29, 2011 at 7:28 pm

    What about HUD buying houses that are being foreclosed on for the Eureka first home buyers program. The buyer only gets a small portion of profit if they sell and the property is again only to go to another first home buyer. It wouldn’t ever be available on the housing market. Wouldn’t that be creating public housing?

  112. taxed
    May 29, 2011 at 7:34 pm

    Oh yeah, I forgot about the part where it will be sold at below market value.

  113. Down the Road
    May 29, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    Stupid me. I did the math all wrong. Now I feel as
    stupid as the Progressives.

    May 29, 2011 at 8:02 pm

    everything that is based on “valuated tax revenue” is propped-up, so below market value is probably still on the higher side above “real value”. As the Housing Industry is fluctuating like that of a Bearish reversal, it is highly unlikely values will get back to where they were a few years ago…..stick a fork in the housing industry for the next decade if were lucky.


  115. High Finance
    May 29, 2011 at 8:49 pm

    Down The Road. I believe that Eureka is giving over $50,000 per year to the MAC but Humboldt County is giving another $100,000 ? I could be off on the county’s amount but it is at least $100,000.

  116. taxed
    May 30, 2011 at 10:51 am

    High Finance I think you may vave hit the tip of the iceberg on the figures. Hope to hear from DTR more about the $ on the MAC. I have heard the price tag before but forget the exact numbers.

  117. Anon
    May 30, 2011 at 11:27 am

    The County used to give $300,000 a year to the MAC but I don’t know if that has changed. Probably listed in the County budget somewhere.

  118. Anon
    May 30, 2011 at 11:33 am

    You forgot about all the 1100 plus salaries that have to be paid in your equasion. A few years ago there were only about 950 employees of DHSS.

    Surprising about how high some of their salaries are. Look it up on the county web site. Director of DHSS makes just under $14,000 a month.

  119. Down the Road
    May 30, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    I have read in the letters to the editor in the TS
    the total cost of the MAC was $5,000,000. Don’t know
    if this is correct.

    11-1-07 TS: The county & Eureka stepped in with more
    than $120,000 in emergency funding. Also kicked out
    the single males. Women & children get more welfare.
    12-02-07 TS: Eureka stepped up with $60,000.
    7-12-10 TS: County Dept. of Health & Human Services
    joins forces with RCAA. County approves $498,940 budgeted into social services fund.
    7-14-10 TS: Roughly half of the center $l,000,000 budget comes from Cal Works.

    When purchasing the MAC, Eureka utilized state grants
    of 2.5 million. If the MAC closes the city has to
    repay the funds. The sucking sound you hear in Eureka is not the tide going out. The City of Eureka
    had no business getting involved in this project.

  120. Anonymous
    May 30, 2011 at 1:04 pm

    ***High Finance says:
    May 29, 2011 at 5:55 pm

    Serious question “Big Picture”. How old are you ?

    Throw his blatant lies back in his face…and this is the “debate” you get!

    Then, a seamless return to this bigots BS against the poor!

    It’s as if tens of millions of high skilled jobs were never outsourced and trillions of public dollars were never looted to float the biggest corporate welfare mothers this world has ever known.

    No, no, recent history has just begun and it’s the damn poor, homeless, uninsured, foreigners, unions, gays, etc, to be blamed!!

    Please refer to Mien Kampf for a complete list.


  121. Anon
    May 30, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    Down the Road at 12:17 PM said: When purchasing the MAC, Eureka utilized state grants
    of 2.5 million. If the MAC closes the city has to
    repay the funds.

    I remember that one and I believe that is now a big problem if the MAC would have to close. Where would Eureka get the funds to repay as they were to repay the money they received?

    Things are not always what they seem to be. The MAC has helped a few familys but then the Mission has helped about the same number with private donations. If I have clothes that can be used I take them to the Mission as at least someone gets something they don’t have to pay for. So far I have never been homeless but you never know when things could change and you are the person in need, but I certainly understand the plight of someone that doesn’t have a coat or even a change of clothes. I donate where I believe it does the most good.

    Sometimes government money does not seem to help very many because of their salaries and lots of their expenses.

  122. High Finance
    May 30, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    I remember that stipulation as well 7.12pm. But I seem to recall there was a time limit on it.

    Given up your other names 1.04pm ?

  123. Anonymous
    May 31, 2011 at 11:37 am

    “HiFi”, with your permission I’m sure Heraldo will reveal some of the names you’ve posted under.

    Meanwhile, ignoring your own lies doesn’t make them go away.

    I would guess that you are 15 to 20 years old based entirely upon your spelling and grammar.

  124. High Finance
    May 31, 2011 at 8:52 pm

    You hide your trollness with various identities.

    I post only under my name. If you’re going to be a weird little pecker at least you could be honest about it. Meantime, if the words of PJ, GFYS.

  125. May 31, 2011 at 10:19 pm

    I post only under my name.


  126. Anonymous
    May 31, 2011 at 11:25 pm


    This creep has no shame.

    Glad he’s on “their” team.

  127. High Finance
    June 1, 2011 at 11:07 am

    You post that shit & YOU have no shame ?

  128. High Finance
    June 1, 2011 at 11:13 am

    I have corrected the problem with my Avatars. But that is cool, I now have a red one & a blue one. I post only under my name here, ahem yourself Heraldo, but I use Anonymous on other blogs.

    Perhaps I will save the red one when someone says something especially useless like 11.25pm.

  129. June 1, 2011 at 11:14 am

    Good to see you have changed your ways.

  130. Anonymous
    June 1, 2011 at 11:44 am


    Throw his prolific lies back in his face and watch a festering hypocrite spew venom.

    Maybe the folks at the Mirror would enjoy such misery.

  131. High Finance
    June 1, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    You need to seek some serious help there 11.44am.

  132. Anonymous
    June 1, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    The only insanity here is watching a “weird little pecker’s” herculean contortions to avoid responding to his lies listed above.

    Thanks for the laugh.

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